June 17, 2024 — Meeting Transcript

Good evening, everyone, and welcome to the Planned Commission ARB for June 17th. If you have any electronic gadgets, please put them on silent at this time. Obie, we'll start with the roll call or Brian.

Steve Lichtenfeld here. Here Ellen Gatiss

here.

Bridget McAndrew

here.

Helen DiFate

Helen DeFate

here.

Kami Waldman

Amy Waldman

here.

David Gipson

David Gibson

here. Okay. We have minutes from the previous meeting on June 3rd. Are there any changes? Seeing none, do we have a motion?

I'll make a motion to approve the minutes. Second.

All in favor?

Aye.

Opposed? Okay. Let's move on to new business. And the first and only item is 7801 Forsyth Boulevard. And we'll start with the staff review.

Property is at the northwest corner of Forest Ith and Beamiston. It is zoned high density commercial and is in the northeast downtown overlay. In September of 2022, the ARB approved two wall signs located at the roof line via sign modification and with the condition that the signs be bronze to match the roof band facade. The applicant would like to install new signs of the same design, but of a darker bronze. The darker bronze is a departure from the subdued signs approved by the ARB in 2022. However, several previous tenant signs contrasted from the roof band. Given that the roof band is a logical place for signage and that the structure has historically held signs that contrast with the band color, staff are of the opinion that the darker bronze would result in a minimal visual impact and staff recommend approval as submitted.

Okay, thank you. Tyler, are you speaking or?

Good evening, everyone. Tyler Stevens, Corten Architecture. Do you need my address? On behalf of M1 Bank, and thank you all for seeing us tonight. I'm sorry that you have to come out for this one boring item, but we are obviously very excited about this building. And I hope that you all, having been watching it go up and nearing completion are as well. We think it's a really great addition to downtown Clayton. So we're happy with it. The sign band, as we discussed before, this is one of those issues where one of those items when artistic expression maybe and regulatory matters don't necessarily align. We had all discussed at the previous meeting having a sign that matches in the same color It's kind of a tone on tone expression, which I thought originally was a good idea. Still artistically, I think it's a good idea. But in terms of how a sign is supposed to function, in terms of drawing attention, being legible, all that. And then, of course, things that you all may not be aware of or maybe you are, I don't know. But with banks, there's a lot of regulatory procedures. And one of those things is that the sign be legible to a certain degree. And after having put up the original sign, we received feedback that it's not complying with that, essentially, and that it needs to be darker. So we met with our client, who's here as well, Ken Petit, president of the bank. We all sort of discussed it. And we felt that going to a darker color would be the logical solution. And rather than going to maybe what is a kind of the obvious solution of just making a black sign. We thought that a dark bronze would be in keeping with the spirit of the original intent, something in that family of the gold that is the roof band, but yet darker. So I have samples here for you tonight. If you'd like to see and I can pass these around or I can just hold it up. This is the color of the roof band. And as you know, the sign is originally the same color. This is a sample that I just got today of the bronze color that would be in it. So as you can see, they're in the same family, just a darker version. And so that is our proposal to change it to that. The signs, just so you know, it will be changed immediately due to just timing and all that by painting it in place. That is actually an acceptable thing from the sign company that they say will have just as good a lasting warranty as know what's there now however as a backup we are having new signs made of the same color so that eventually when they are made they can just be swapped out to the uh what's there today essentially so with that i'll take any questions and if you'd like to see this i can pass it around

well tyler when you paint the sign what does that do to the

illumination The illumination is behind the sign. It's a backlit with lights, so that doesn't change. It's lit right now. If you go by at night, you can see it, kind of what it looks like in its lit form, and none of that is going to change.

Okay. I have no problem with the color. I think you and the building owner have worked that out, and I think it'll work fine. But we'll go around and see. Carolyn?

Yeah, I actually like it better. I think it's going to be beautiful. But the absolute intent is to replace it with something that's integral with the color, not just leave the painted one

up. Yeah, although I will tell you that the one that is up there now and what will be is still a painted metal. That's just how they're made. They're not, the metal color is not, it's not what you'd call an integral color. Metal just doesn't work that way. like it does with porcelain or so many different other materials.

I think it's going to look great.

Richard?

No comments. I think it looks really nice, and it has been fun to see the building go up. I live nearby, and I'm constantly by the bank, so it's been fun to see. The progress, and it's exciting that it is almost done. It looks great. Thank

you. Ellen?

It looks good. I mean, I go by constantly. So yeah, what you have is just as you described right now, very subtle. And yes, I would do that. But I understand that aesthetics is not paramount in this decision. It's visibility. So looks great.

Kami?

Yeah, no issues with it. I actually think it's an improvement as well.

Good. David, do you have any comments? Tyler, you've heard me say it before, but I think your client should hear it. I think it's the most elegant building in all of downtown Clayton. And to think that it was a rehabilitation of an old building makes it even better. So we thank the entire owner design crew. It's a great addition. We're happy to have it. Thank you. But now we do have a staff recommendation to approve as submitted. Do we have a motion? A

motion to approve as submitted? Second.

All in favor?

Aye.

Opposed? You're on the way. Thank you. Thanks very much, everyone, for coming in.

Steve, if I may, just after the meeting is through, just knowing that we're coming back in July for a different project and different matter, if I could have your ear and the council for five minutes, if that's an appropriate thing to do after we close out, I'd appreciate that.

We'd like to close the meeting and so there's no conflict at that point. Amy, any comments?

Nothing for me.

Ellen?

No comment.

Bridget?

No comment.

David, nothing to add. Well, I do have a

comment. Go ahead, Steve.

Carolyn, this is your final meeting. Your term is ending. But I'd like to say we really appreciate the six years that you have brought a certain expertise to us. Yeah. Oh, I thought you would say it was 10.

No, it

was six. And we will miss your expertise.

I'm around if something comes up.

We know where to find you. So we thank you very much. We appreciate it. And the staff has a little something also.

And Carolyn, I just wanted to say too, on behalf of the Board of Aldermen, thank you very much for your service. I know we all really appreciate it.

Oh my gosh. Give me a landscape architect, a plant. That is so sweet of you guys. Thank you. I was just thinking about orchids the other day. That's so weird. It's beautiful. Wow. Thank you very much. It's been a pleasure. Will

it fit in your car?

Beefy, she gets golf clubs and a carton. It's a fiat for those who don't

have

an idea.

Thank

you. No, this has been great. I learned a lot and got to meet a lot of the community. And it's been fun, honestly, except for the three plus hour ones. This was not one of those. No. Nice to have a short one.

So we thank you for everything, and we invite you back whenever you'd like to come and participate.

Now I can buy for Clayton Projects.

Right.

Yeah, without the

conflict. So beyond that, Ryan, any

words of wisdom? Next agenda is going to be a little bit more full than usual, so get excited.

And that'll be on July 1st. Well, thank you, everyone. The meeting is adjourned.

Oops.

Oh, sorry. Stuart, are you part of the meeting?

allow some public comment and I've been at the meetings for the past couple of months.

If you'd like to make short comments, yes, but be sure to identify yourself. I'm going to do that right now.

My name is Stu Berkowitz. I think most of you know me at least directly or indirectly. I'm not sure if that's good or bad thing, but I'm also an attorney and I'm here really because I'm a and I've been observing your meetings for the past two months at least, but I've been sort of tasked to assist you with the planning document that was approved two weeks ago. If you look at the document, equity is embedded in the planning process. And so the commission has asked me to sort of assist you in dealing with the implementation of that planning document, primarily the question of land use. But my thing, I'm not an elected official. I'm just a citizen. I'm volunteering my time. But my experience on the Equity Commission, I think, could be valuable to this commission in terms of walking through and dealing with, I think, the systemic issues that are raised by that planning document. Primarily, which stayed right at me when I saw it, is the zoning issues. And either we have to piecemeal amend the zoning we have or just do you know replace and repair just doing one one big thing but not going to really begin implementing your chore with the uh the planning aspects if we don't deal with the zoning first and then you know below that is the neighborhood guidelines so um My background, I think, could be useful. A little bit different than Ira. When I started at Washington Law School, I interned at the legal aid program. I went in my first job out of law school was with a program called Land of Lincoln in East St. Louis. It covered Southern Illinois. We represent basically poor people. It's income based. It's not based upon your race or ethnic or whatever. It's based upon your income. And that's sort of in me as to what, you know, what he means. Now the purpose of the equity commission does focus on, you know, racial disparities and racial issues that historically Clayton has had to deal with. Uh, but, uh, for me, uh, going forward, um, I think that the, you know, the issue of inequality, uh, low income, housing issues, deal more with income-based and racial issues fall right into that. So I think as an attorney, you know, my job has been solving problem. And to me, this is just another big problem that needs to be solved. And so, um, my suggestion is that, you know, we were not based upon our experience with the equity commission. We started, you know, ground zero I've been on since day one. Um, The real work was done in between meetings. We divided into a lot of sort of subcommittees, which different fields of interest. And then we come back and make reports to the commission and ultimately some recommendations to the board of aldermen. Now, Typically, I think you work more reactive. You get the recommendations from the planning department and then you act on that from the agenda. But these things really are different. You're going to have to be proactive because changing our zoning code, for example, is not going to happen automatically. organically on its own. It's got to be done by people working on it. That's going to have to have input from maybe a select committee from the planning commission, working with different people in the neighborhoods, different special interests, corporate, retail, whatever. But I'm more than happy to be part of that. It doesn't make any sense for me to just come to the meeting, sit silent and do nothing. Okay. Nobody wants to waste their time. Certainly I don't want to waste my time. I'm sort of retired in a way. but I'm more than willing to donate my time and expertise to assist you. So having said that, let me open it up to you, Steve, if you have any ideas to move forward. And one of the reasons I did it today, not tonight, was because your agenda was pretty light.

Well, thank you. Well, Stu, we never expect you to be silent when you're here. But as we go forward, I believe you probably heard Anna at our last meeting that the staff is going to begin looking at the zoning and the codes and everything, and then we will be discussing it. Uh, it's not going to be a done deal without a full discussion by the entire plan commission. Uh, at that time, we're always open to, uh, comments from anyone not sitting up here and we will be open and, uh, hopefully have a spirited dialogue in making it happen. So I'm not only saying that you should be here, but, uh, you and or any other member of the Equity Commission, as well as any of the other boards and commissions within the city of Clayton. And I'm sure we will have just some citizens that will come and voice their opinion also. I don't think this will be a very quick resolution of changes. I think it's going to be ongoing. for our city and we will have to respond at various times as things change. But I think that's the way it works. I think we have a leadership in our planning department that will really spearhead it, bring it back to all of us, and we will have strong negotiations. Then, of course, the Board of Aldermen will be in it also. And we'll get there, but it will not be overnight. So I appreciate your comments and certainly your willingness to participate. And we will look forward to yours and others also. So we thank you.

Thank you.

Any other comments from the audience? No. Any comments from the board? Well, then we are adjourned for the night. See you all on July 1st. Thank you. Yeah, Tyler, put that hand to me after we adjourn.