July 17, 2023 — Meeting Transcript

Good evening everyone and welcome to the Plain Commission ARB for July 17th. If you have any electronic devices, please silence them at this time. Ryan?

Steve Lichtenfeld? Here. Carolyn Gatiss?

Bridget McAndrew?

Bob Denlow? Helen DiFate?

Bob Denlo? Helen DeFate?

Kami Waldman?

Amy Waldman?

David Gipson? Here.

David Gibson? Here.

We have minutes from the previous meeting on July 3rd. Are there any changes?

favor?

Opposed? Okay. We'll go into new business now. The first item is 7810A Forsyth. And is the applicant here? Okay, hold on. We have the stacked report first. Okay. And this will be for the conditional use permit for Barcelona. Ryan? Sorry.

The applicant is seeking a conditional use permit to allow the operation of a restaurant on the subject property located on the south side of Forsyth Boulevard between South Central Avenue and Bemiston Avenue. The property is a zoning designation of high-density commercial and is located in the northeast downtown overlay district. The site is currently developed with a two-story commercial building and was previously home to Mayana Mexican Kitchen. The applicant is seeking to operate Barcelona, a tapas bar and restaurant. I will provide a summary of the review criteria for the full analysis can be found on the in the staff report and on the pending applications page on the city's website. Proposed hours of operation are 11am to 1am Monday through Saturday and 11am to 12am on Sunday. The proposed restaurant measures 1600 square feet and will include roughly 26 seats, the adjacent sidewalk is intended for outdoor seating which will require separate permitting. Off-street parking is not required for restaurants located in the Central Business District measuring less than 3,000 square feet. Deliveries will be handed via an adjacent alley between the hours of 7 a.m. and 11 a.m., Monday through Friday. Trash and recycling will be handled via existing facilities at the rear of the building. Staff are of the opinion that the proposed restaurant is compatible with their surrounding area and will not result in adverse impact as it relates to traffic, noise, odor, utilities, and emergency services. Staff recommend that this board recommend approval of the conditional use permit to the Board of Aldermen as submitted.

Okay, thank you. Now we're ready for the applicant. If you'd come up, introduce yourself and add anything you'd like to for the conditional use permit.

Yeah, so my name is Nicole Johnson. I'm with Nations KEC. I'm representing Frank Schmitz for the Barcelona restaurant, and we look forward to his reopening in your guys' town.

Okay. Do you see any problems with the staff report?

I do

not. Well, that's good to hear. We're eager to have Barcelona back in downtown, and I saw no problem with the conditional use permit, but let's go around and see if there are any other comments. I just

had a quick question about the Sunday 11 to 12 a.m. Is it really till 12 a.m.?

That's what he had down, but if that needs to be adjusted, I'm sure that he's willing to- do that for any recommendations

okay I just thought maybe it was a typo

so I think

that on Sunday

Anna I just had a question about that too is that I mean are those hours I mean I guess you would have made a note of it but those hours are normal for it just seems a little bit later than

It's similar to a few other restaurants in downtown. I'd say that a lot of our restaurants tend to have hours of operation that allow them more flexibility than what they typically actually operate at. So there are some restaurants that have similar hours in their conditional use permits, but most of them aren't actually open until 12 a.m. on Sundays. I

want to make sure. Other than that, everything looks fine.

Ellen?

Amy?

David. No questions. Okay. Well, we do have a staff recommendation to approve the CUP to the Board of Aldermen. Do we have a motion?

I'll make a motion to approve the condition use permit to the Board of Eldermen. Second.

All in favor? Aye. Opposed? Okay. It's the first half. We'll go into architectural review now and Ryan will

start off. with the same property. Proposed front facade changes include color changes and storefront door system. The existing exterior features storefront glass with a silver trim. The applicant is proposing black gridded windows with red accents and a red front door. A red awning sign is proposed above the entry that will match the red window accents in the front door. Outdoor dining with matching red furniture is proposed on the adjacent sidewalk. Similar low-rise commercial structure by feature of variety of colors, windows types, and signage. Both the proposed signage and the outdoor dining will require separate permitting. The subject property falls within the Northeast downtown overlay district. This district is described as pedestrian friendly retail and entertainment area that promotes development at a human scale. Staff are of the opinion that the proposed changes are compatible with the existing structure surrounding area and overlay district and will contribute to a pedestrian friendly environment. Staff recommends approval as submitted.

Okay, thank you. Any other comments?

No, I do not have any.

Okay. It's pretty simple, but you do realize there would be other permits required.

Yes, I do know that I have to apply for the outdoor seating permit, the sign permit, as well as a occupancy. And I think there was one other permit that I would be required to gather, which was the building for the installation of the door system.

I think it looks good. It brings back the color and the logo that we've been used to for years. I think it's great. Carolyn?

I didn't have any comments on it.

Bridget?

Is there something, what is a storefront door system? Is that something different than just a regular front door? I don't know.

No, it's your standard commercial system. Okay. I don't

remember ever seeing storefront door system. Yeah,

let me, I do want to, I'll show you the spec sheet on that. As soon as I find it here. Here we go.

Will that system open up?

Yes.

As it did in the old location?

Looks good. Thank you,

Amy.

Yeah, no comments. Just welcome back. Excited.

David, no questions

or comments. Okay. We have a staff recommendation to approve as submitted.

I'll make a motion to approve as submitted. Second.

Easy enough. So as far as the next steps, whenever it does go to the alderman, does that require another meeting here or does it, how does that work? I'm sorry.

It will be another meeting here in the chambers. I'm not sure what the date would be.

So tomorrow you'll get an email that will tell you what the date is. I'm looking for it right now. It's next month because we had to advertise for it. So yeah, I think August 8th, I believe, but we'll send you a follow-up email. We don't need any new submissions from you for that meeting.

Perfect. The only problem would be is that I may be out of town on vacation on the 8th, but he can come, right? Right. Anybody that can represent

the request would be great. Thank you

guys. I really appreciate your time. And then may I be excused or do you want me to wait for the remainder of the meeting?

No.

All right. You guys have a great day. Thank you so much.

Okay. We'll move on to item three, 7908 Kingsbury and Ryan.

The subject property is located on the south side of Kingsbury Boulevard between North Central Avenue and North Merrimack Avenue. The property is zoned R5 and is developed with a multifamily condominium. The applicant is seeking to replace damaged siding with an identical vinyl. Vinyl is not an approved material per the architecture review guidelines. The applicant has stated that the redwood siding used in the building's 1980s construction is no longer sold, and the selected vinyl will best reflect the original siding. The surrounding area comprises multifamily apartments and condominiums ranging two to five stories. Nearby materials often include brick with siding or stucco with secondary materials. Siding can be found as a primary ritual on some nearby single-family homes. The subject property comprises varying colors of orange and brown brick with brown redwood siding as an accent material. The section of siding to be replaced is located on the structure's western facade adjacent to a four-story apartment building. The two structures are separated by roughly five feet. Much of the facade to be replaced is screened from the street view by a brick chimney and the adjacent apartment. Staff are of the opinion that the use of vinyl would have a minimal visual impact. The staff recommends approval as submitted.

Okay, thank you. Is the applicant here? Come up and introduce yourself.

Hi, my name is Lori Goodman. I live at 223 North Central. I'm one of three managers of the association. There's seven units in the complex. Five of them are on North Central and two of them are on Kingsbury. I've only been a manager of the association for about six months. And in that time, I've come to realize that having been built in 1980, there's a lot of deferred maintenance that needs to be done on the exteriors, which of course associations are responsible for. And I also realized that vinyl isn't a material that Clayton would prefer to see on a building in view. But in this particular case, the side of this building is, I measured it actually and Ryan was pretty correct. While it has a full eight foot space between the two buildings, the projected window on the side of our building is actually three more feet. So there's actually five feet. And the building itself, the 7908 building sits up seven steps from the street. So if you walk or drive by, you literally would be trying to see between five feet and up seven steps to see this side. And I did bring the materials. So the complex was originally built in 1980, and it used redwood siding and a pink brick. And all of the siding is in relatively good condition, but it actually all needs to be painted, which is a a pretty large job. And, um, we also have, we haven't actually gotten a full, um, uh, uh, exact cost on this because we didn't want to cause the contractor to have to do a full estimate until we knew whether we could even use a material knot, because if not, then we're going to have to step back and consider what other options there are. The reveal on the siding is only, um, two and a half inches it's a very thin uh lap siding and i've researched that somewhat and it doesn't seem like that is actually available there are mills in town that could mill it if we need to replace it in other areas of the buildings but and which we may need to do at some point but for this particular side it seemed like the most economical material to use and um that I think it would not be an eyesore as the only people that would see it would be someone walking through, or possibly people who live in the next building whose windows actually are only eight feet from ours, you know, from our building.

You can hold it up so we can hear

you. This is the wooden siding that we have. And this would be the lap of

And there's a brown color here

And this does have a somewhat of a wood texture to it.

Laurie, if you could turn it around

it, it may come out. It may actually be that only the upper part. So we can see that there's been some of this lap that has separated from the building at the very top on the gables. The projected window itself may be able to be repaired and painted. We just don't know until we get a better view of it, so.

Well, I certainly sympathize with you because I have redwood siding on my house. And it requires, in my case, restaining about every three to five years, especially what faces west. And this is the area you're talking about. It's a

western exposure. And then you also have another brick building next door that creates more heat and gas. I have to say that in the 40 plus years that the building has been built, I'm not actually sure whether the whole thing has been painted more than once. In fact, the sample came off of my projected window over my deck and I took it into a mill to ask them if they had a dye that they could use to cut this and they said yes, but he said that it looks like the original paint. So on most areas of the building in 43 years, that's a pretty good longevity. But this particular side got worse, had worse.

Well, comparing that west side

of

7908 to the fronts on the north and the east side of the other seven buildings. They haven't

had any of the same damage. Not at all. No, not at all.

No. So I have no problem with using the vinyl on this west-facing portion, but I'd like it not to become a precedent for the redwood on the two street facades.

Well, there's more than two. There's the five buildings on Central and then there's the two on Kingsbury. And in fact, we currently have a permit request in for all the decks to be replaced on all of the buildings which is an over a three hundred thousand dollar project which is still in review by the um permit department but that is going to be um so a lot of the wood siding that was on the buildings at the time is going to be removed we're then going to have black metal um barriers you know or fencing and um And that project is supposed to start sometime in August. So a lot of the wood that was part of the deck will be removed and that will eliminate having to have, and then the trex or a composite decking material will be used so that a lot of the painting that was needed up until now is no longer gonna be required after the decks are replaced.

Well, we all understand having less maintenance is good going forward. Also, your deck replacement project really, except for the most northern building on Merrimack, you really don't see it from the street.

On Central, you don't see any of the decks. They're all on the backside. There is one unit on the Kingsbury side that has a corner decking and that is going to be, they requested it to be not the open type of metal. They would like to maintain their privacy there by having the wood and that's gonna be real wood and it will be painted the same color as the, and it's going to be rebuilt in the same way that it is now. That won't have, the deck areas don't have lap siding. They have vertical panels.

Well, right now we're only talking about the west side of 79. So

that would be the only area in the complex that we would want you to consider this use of this material.

I am in favor of it as the staff report has stated, but let's see other comments. Carolyn?

I'm also in favor of it. I think nobody's going to see it and even getting through those buildings to go and repair it as often as you would need it to be is painful. So... I definitely agree with Steve.

Richard?

Yep,

I agree as well. It sounds like I'm not sure. Well,

it'll be an economical solution to that problem, which will then allow us to use extra funds for other painting and maintenance and repair of other wood. And of course, we'll have to have this. If we can't find it, we'll have it milled for other locations in the complex.

It sounds like you've undertaken a pretty big job in the last six months.

Well, and not knowing that someone unexpectedly retired like on a day's notice and I volunteered. So I've had some- Probably won't

volunteer again.

A lot of projects that I've developed over the years, rehab and additions. So it's up my alley, but it's just more than I had. And I'd rather know these things than not to know them, you know.

talked to a couple different people about this. I've talked to contractors who would try to do woodwork. And actually, the property management company who handles our business activities has a contractor who wanted to use pine Now, a pine lap siding that had three, it's sort of like this. It has three laps together. And then I talked to another contractor who told me that if we use pine in this particular case, while the redwood or fir could have lasted 40 or 45 years, pine is not going to last that long. And If you use inexpensive materials now i'm not referring to vinyl is is more of a long lasting material, even though it's less expensive, but if you use inexpensive would such as pine you're going to be redoing the job, you know. Five or 10 years and that's the problem in condo living is that people don't want to pay for the next owners, you know, but. They have to decide how long are they going to live there and how much do they want to spend and let the next person come along and make a more of an investment. But at this point in time, I think in this particular case, this is the best option.

Ellen, did you have more?

I got an estimate for that.

Yeah, but well, so in terms of the hierarchy of price, of course, Redwood's going to be the top. Hardy board was not inexpensive. And the person who gave me the quote is one of the top authorized Hardy board installers in St. Louis. And he obviously didn't really want to do the job. talked about the scaffolding he was gonna put up. So the cost ended up being pretty high. It's a small job and it's also a very heavy material. You know, it can be heavier than wood. And because we've got so many details there, it probably would have been problematic for them. And that may have been partly why the cost was so high.

Amy? I

David? No concerns. Okay. We do have a staff recommendation to approve as submitted. I'd

like a motion to approve as submitted? Second.

All in favor?

Aye.

this information would be for, or will I receive something to submit with the permit?

I believe you'll receive everything.

Okay.

It's the same department. So Ryan, who has assisted you with this, will also make sure that the building permit or whatever permit you need to do the work is granted.

Well, thank you all very much. Thank

you. Okay, we'll move on to item four. And that's 69 Arundel is the applicant here. Okay, we'll start with the staff report.

Ryan. The subject property is located on the north side of Arundel Place between University Lane and DeMunn Avenue. The site is developed with a two-story single family home and is zoned R2. The project scope includes the partial demolition of the rear of the home, rear deck, and rear patio to construct a residential addition, screened porch, new basement stairs, and brick paver paths. The surrounding neighborhood largely comprises of brick single family homes. Rear additions are common and can be found in a variety of sizes and materials. The addition is proposed to be two stories and comprise of brick and EIFS stucco matching the existing structure. The existing structure comprises of dark red brick with EIFS as a secondary material on the existing addition and upper portions of the structure. The portions of the existing side and rear facades that are to remain include EIFS from beginning at the bottom of the windows and continuing to the roofline. The EIFS wraps the existing northwest corner and is proposed to be mirrored on the addition at the northeast corner. The proposed EIFS would comprise 27% of the rear facade, exceeding the 25% limit. Staff are of the opinion that the proportion of secondary material is compatible and appropriate due to the existing facades composition. New windows are proposed to be dark green matching existing windows and some existing windows will be filled. A screened porch is proposed at the rear of the addition comprising of treated wood painted white atop a brick foundation. A new stone path and basement access are proposed adjacent to the porch. Existing HVAC, trash, rear patio, and rear pergola will remain unchanged. Impervious coverage is proposed to decrease from 58% to 55%. Staff are of the opinion that the proposed addition is compatible with the existing property and surrounding area. Staff recommends approval is submitted.

Introduce yourself and give us any comments.

Hi, I'm Cassandra Cook. I'm the architect for the project. And no, don't really have a whole lot to say. I mean, I'm just trying to keep the, you know, respecting the existing structure we tried to design this in such a way to fit within the context of obviously the neighborhood and that's what you guys are here for so i feel comfortable with what we proposed and hope you guys like it as well

uh i feel comfortable with it also i think it fits uh with the existing house and the context of the neighborhood, how other houses have enlarged their structure similarly. The details are beautiful on it. And I had no problem at all. The only thing I did have a question on is the reduction in the impervious coverage. How did you achieve that?

Well, we are removing an existing patio kind of area in the back. And then that's where most of the addition is going. But then we're also removing... There's a section of concrete that goes between the existing concrete driveway to the existing brick path. So there's a big patch of concrete there that in order to achieve that, we found that that is the most... the thing that makes the most sense to remove that concrete in order to hit that 55%.

Well, it works. I just couldn't tell from the plan. I apologize.

I didn't put demo in here.

I have no problem with it. I think it's a beautiful addition and it fits. Carolyn?

I have no problem with it either. I do have a question about the tree behind the new one-story screen porch. Will there be tree protection fencing on that during construction?

If there needs to be, absolutely.

And there probably should be anyways. So yeah. And then the one near where you're constructing the new stairs, I guess it might not be encroaching on that.

Yeah, that

one's on the other side of the fence. Oh, okay. It's hard to tell. Yeah. Okay, that's all I had on it, actually.

No comments. It looks nice.

Yeah,

it looks

David? No comments.

Okay, we have a staff recommendation to approve as submitted.

I'll make a recommendation to approve as submit. Second.

All in favor?

Aye.

Opposed?

Okay. When will you

start? We're just waiting to get some stuff back from structural. So hopefully this fall sometime.

Well, good luck with it.

Thank you. And I also want to say that Ryan was very helpful. Thank you for all of your help. I appreciate it.

we have come to item five. And this will be a conceptual review at 111 and 121 South Merrimack. And as always, we'll start with Ryan, and then we'll have the applicant.

Site comprises two parcels in an alley-zoned high-density commercial located in the northwest corner of the intersection of Bonham and South Merrimack. The north property, 111 South Merrimack, is currently vacant. The south property, 121 South Merrimick, is currently developed with a vacant office building that is colloquially known as the World Trade Site. A 20-foot wide alley is located between the two parcels. The proposed project consists of the partial demolition and renovation of the structure at 121 South Merrimack, vacation of the portion of the alley, and construction of a 21-story, 240-foot mixed-use building on 111 South Merrimick Avenue. The combined structure is proposed to total 312,250 square feet and will include residential, commercial, amenity, and parking space. Residential amenities are proposed to include a pool, club room, fitness center, and movie theater. A 2,000 square foot commercial space is proposed at the north end of the development. Parking is proposed to be a combination of existing onsite parking, new below grade parking, and a 50-year lease with an adjacent garage. Complementary but distinct styles are proposed for the north and south sections. The south section is characterized by a window wall with floors visually distinguished by horizontal bands. The styles continued as the structure transitions to the north portion. As the tower rises above the south section, the horizontal bands are spaced every other floor with exceptions at the base and the summit. The horizontal bands are proposed to be a combination of concrete and porcelain panels. Public art is proposed on the upper exterior of the facade tower. No roof distinction or activation is proposed at this time. Changes to the streetscape are proposed along Merrimack. The vacation of the alley eliminates a curb cut and returns that space to sidewalk use. Seating is proposed along a landscaped area fronting the sidewalk. A community pocket park is identified at the building's entrance. Outdoor seating and dining space is proposed adjacent to the retail space. An art canopy is proposed to round the corner of Merrimack and Bonham. An art sculpture is proposed adjacent to the entrance of the parking garage on Bonham. The project is proposed as a planned unit development and will require public hearings before the plan commission and Board of Aldermen. Deviations from the underlying zoning proposed and proposed public benefits have not been specified by the applicant at this time. Properties zoned high-density commercial may be eligible for consideration as a PUD if they contain a combination of uses and exceed the maximum floor area ratio. As proposed, this concept would qualify for PUD consideration. The subject properties reside in the Central Station District as identified in the Downtown Master Plan. The Master Plan recommends mixed-use developments, widening sidewalks, small-scale parks, and the removal of blank walls and parking lots. A project of this scale requires a thorough staff review prior to public hearing. The project will be reviewed and is subject to comments from Planning, Public Works, the Fire Department, and the city's contracted consultants for landscape, stormwater management, traffic, and parking. Staff recommends that the Planning Commission and Architecture Reward consider the proposal and provide input. This is conceptual review only, and therefore any comments made in this report or at the meeting either by applicants, staff, or the board members are not binding. Staff offers the following comments based on the conceptual plans received. More detailed plans are necessary for staff to determine deviations from the code and proposed public benefits. Future submittals should include renderings of the proposed design from the street and pedestrian perspectives, the height and design of railings and landscaping along the race plaza will impact the pedestrian experience and activation of the public right-of-way and scaled elevations will help determine the context. The applicant should consider redesigning the pocket park to be more open to the streetscape. The current location design appear as part of a private development and the plaza is not likely to function as a public space. The applicant should consider enhancements to the street level facade on Bonham Avenue to mitigate the visual impact of the parking garage. The applicant should considered modifications to the roof design to create architectural distinction or skyline activation. City standard downtown streetscape will be required along the perimeter of the development. Additional details are required to show how the existing grades, raised plazas, proposed landscape and proposed seating areas will be integrated with the streetscape standards. The proposed development is located at a prominent corner in downtown with high vehicle and pedestrian traffic. Development as proposed orients private amenities and spaces towards the corner and public right-of-way with the commercial component located mid block set back from the street. The proposed commercial component is also a very small portion of the overall development. Additional commercial space should be located along the first floor to activate the site and increase proportion of mixed uses. Turning radius studies and site distance diagrams shall be provided as part of the civil plan package for the garage and service access areas. A detailed traffic generation impact study that addresses parking issues as well will be required. This should be coordinated through public works with the selected on-call consultant.

Okay, thank you. I see the applicant or applicants are here. Come on up and introduce yourself

and add anything you would like. Sure. Good evening. My name is Paul Giacoletto, and I represent Revive Capital Development. Along with me is Chris Cedergreen, representing our design architect team. and put together the design that you're looking at this evening. First, thank you for taking your time. As Ryan explained, this is a conceptual review. We wanted to get your all view of the building and our plans before we got too deep into into the design so that we could incorporate those as we're going along rather than dropping something on you and saying, what do you think? It's much easier for us to incorporate those items now and get your thoughts and understand what we can do and what may be more difficult to achieve. I'll have Chris walk you through the design as we have it now.

Hi, I'm Chris Cedergreen. And by the way, Bob Neely from LJC is here too. And they'll be the architects of record on the project as it advances. So the reason, I mean, we really looked at the previous schemes that were done and failed on this site, and it's been vacant for 10 years. There's a lot of desire to make it a very viable addition to this, again, make it a a viable addition to the city from its seven up building origins to what it can be now. As we looked at the earlier solutions, the ultimate solution was to demolish everything. And that came with a real healthy cost. And it's interesting because half of the construction on this project is about 190,000 square feet of existing construction. Half of it is below grade and half of it is above grade. So it's really a lot of demolition and a significant cost to take all that out. So we said, how can we really leave as much in place as possible, still achieve our parking

So to, sorry, it was kind of weird talking about the parking and about the tower, 50-50 roughly construction for the amount of square footage in each of those. The other thing about the tower is it doesn't need code currently from a seismic standpoint or from a fire separation standpoint. The construction type, there's just not enough concrete between each floor to provide the two-hour requirement. And in the parking, because of the salts and everything has been brought in over time, the concrete is delaminating on the lower parking floors. And so we said, all right, if we take off the top five floors of this building, it goes from a high-rise construction to non-high-rise construction, plus our seismic issues um it basically are eliminated because we don't have the same seismic concerns to deal with so it becomes a viable project by capturing the space on the low on the parking level one and parking level two we achieve all of our parking needs But then we mothball the lowest levels. Those are the levels that are having the difficulty with exposed rebar, with delamination. And so we will coat the levels on P1 and P2 to make them viable and to protect the concrete. So we have a viable structure now, P1, P2, all the way up through level five of the existing tower plus its roof, which is level six. So by saving all that construction, only demolishing about 40,000 square feet of the tower, we really are able to make it a viable project from an economic real estate development standpoint. And then we're able to add the 21 story tower on the lot that is known as 121 directly to the north across the alley. So this is an older image. We had updated these since then, but I think you start to get the idea on this particular picture of what we're doing with the Lowe existing building, the plaza that's established there now between the Lowe building and Merrimack, which is towards the bottom of the sheet. And then where the entrance is to the building and the tower, that would be the entrance where the alley currently is. And then on lot 121, that's where the 21-story tower would be. Do you mind going to the next image? Steve, anybody that has questions while I'm talking, I'm happy to answer them.

Let's go through the whole thing.

Okay. Here you see the plaza plan as it exists. At the bottom of the sheet is Merrimack Avenue. On the left is Bonham Avenue. And the first cut that you see off the bottom is the entrance to P1, and it would go under the plaza. And that's the only access there is to P1. And then the next cut further to the west goes to P2. So they both have their own entrances, and they're not connected. They're not connected between P1 and P2, so they come in level on both those levels. Now, the reason that the plaza sits about five feet above Merrimack is they had all this construction below grade, and so they raised the plaza up. And so all of that parking that is in level P1 actually occupies about five feet of space above Merrimack Avenue. So there's been talk about, well, could we demo some of that plaza area? As soon as we start to demo it, we lose all of our parking below in that space where the drive aisles are and where the parking spaces are. So that's why we chose to really make sure that we could maximize the amount of construction that we keep and do not demolish on P1 and P2. So as you can see in the plan here, we're using that amenity deck, that amenity area between Merrimack Avenue and the existing tower for our pool area, our club room, our lounge, all of our common facilities, and then our outdoor pavilions for barbecue and everything that's required in a in a multifamily use project of 300 units or more, because it'll be quite the amenities are really what everything's about now and attracting tenants and keeping them there to stay in the space overall. The pocket park, which was mentioned in Ryan's report right now is located about where the steps come up to the plaza and to the main entry of the building. And it's very easy to go ahead and keep those steps in there. And so the steps would go right up into the pocket park if that really became something to just provide that additional level of accessibility. So it appears that it's part of the street activity, albeit four and a half feet above the street level. rather than part of the independent plaza, if you will. Other than that, you can see in the far purple over on the right is the community retail space, as we call it, of 2,000 square feet. We have an active leasing center and that's pulled back so we have outdoor patio area because the whole idea would be able to have outdoor cafe kind of a feel at that location. And then we fill the rest of the space on the ground floor with all the support services and the brown areas see the top are the additional units on the tower wing. The amenity or the art canopy, we have examples, a precedent on the upper left hand corner. And it's really artwork that is built horizontally and becomes a bit of a screen or a veil, if you will, between views from the courthouse. And apparently the inhabitants across the street, there's some of the juvenile detention facilities are right there. So they'd be looking down on that space. So it becomes a veil for the gathering area and sunning area between the pool at the pool area, but it also becomes something they've become quite a nice feature, not only in the daytime, but at the nighttime as it's lit from both sides, from above and below, and the kind of patterning that it could achieve on both the ceiling, if you will, of that space and on the floor of where the shadows would fall. I think if we could go to the next, you can see the greenery around the edge of the planters that would be installed and those all become the edge around the race plaza, existing race plaza area. So that would all be incorporated to buffer that and make that transition from the plaza area to the edges. Okay, go ahead and. So this parking plan is everything you see coming at the entries off of Bonham on the left. The one towards the bottom again serves P1, the one further to the west serves P2. The parking is all the right now, the column spacing is about 17 feet. That's existing. That's the existing structure. We have access to the service dock at our P2 level that you see in yellow. And then we're able to continue as we expand to the to the north to the lot 121, we're able to ramp down and then access the alley for both ingress and egress for the parking that would take you up to P1 from that alley level. We also get additional service areas down on this level for move-in, move-out, all of our switch gear areas, and then access to the elevators for move-in move-out. Okay, the next image please. So this is a combined floor of the existing tower that's been repurposed into residential on the left and the new tower that is a 21-story tower. And that form would just continue on up to the 21st floor, whereas the element on the left would stop at level four with its roof being at level six. I think we can go to the next shot. This is just looking at the floors will change as we go up. We had 20 floors, we went to 21 because our market study came back and really said we needed some penthouse floors, some larger units that were better appointed than traditional because there's a high demand for those, especially in Clayton. And so we added the 21st floor with outdoor patio or terrace areas. and larger units. So those would be the two plans of the upper floors of the tower. So here on the left is a sketch of, and you see at the base, the base of the building where the parking is, the yellow is the P1 level, which goes about four feet above grade along Merrimack. And it's 10 feet deep. It's a deeper floor to floor. The other parking levels are minimal. They're eight foot floor to floor. So you get minimum ceiling height on P2. But the, just to give you a feel for what's happening on the parking levels and the construction below grade. As you can see in the low rise portion, we basically have skinned, we pulled all of the precast skin off of the building through demolition, and we're gonna reskin it. And as you see in the lower right-hand corner, you start to see just this very simple expression of column and beam and floor slabs with the infill. And so that feeling would be a feeling we wanna carry on the lower five levels. And so this base, this plinth if you will, on the plaza is distinct and everything from level six and above. They still would have some of the same materiality and the same glass, but we really wanna distinguish the existing construction have it tie in with this kind of bridge feature between the low-rise element and the tower into the base of the tower, and then extend up with the two-story expression just to modulate the exterior and vertical fins of concrete that you start to see over on the left. I'm sorry, over on the right. some precedent examples where the one on the tall building is 1550 Mission in San Francisco, and that's all precast. The upper right is a similar project in New Jersey, but that's using the porcelain panel. It's a very thin panel. And then the lower right precedent image for the tower is actually a concrete panel that's about a half inch thick, but they come in very large format. They come in a format four to five feet wide by 12 feet high. And then it's a ventilated skin. So it's a very advanced skin on the building. So again, those are the precedent imagery for where we're taking the exterior of the building. So it's got a textural quality to it, a scale to it. And then as we go to the next image, I think, Ryan, since I... Yeah. As we start to treat these two forms, well, three forms, if you will, the low rise form will be distinct and again be expressed up through level five all the way around the base of both the low rise and the high rise. And then the form, if you see it at the right, the express form on the right here is gonna have its expression. And I'm still kind of developing the expression of the remainder of the building, how it wraps around and how it might transition just to create more verticality and not become too slab-like which seems to be a concern that I'm concerned about or an issue that I'm concerned on just buildings have a little bit more signature quality and identity And then as we're developing this notch at the top of the building, because we have an outdoor terrace for the upper floors, but also then our elevators are really located there and we're able to do an art element that's really embraced in this notch. And then again, we don't have the most current elevations here or the package that I thought we had sent.

It's the green, yes.

Yes, right there. Thank

much. You betcha. And that can be lit at night for sure, so it can really become a signature quality of the building and a nice piece that identifies the building and this location in Clayton. And that basically is where we are. Most of this was developed in the early part of the year, and we made a few changes since we've modified it to respond to some of the market materials that we've gotten back. And we're ready to really dig in and move forward if we get your feedback.

Okay, thanks, Chris. I'm sure we all have a few comments. I'd like to know... how you mothball parking decks three and four, because they're still there to provide some support to the building above it. If you speak into the microphone.

So structurally, they'll continue to provide the support that they do. The areas on P3 and P4 will be blocked off in that they will have an access panel so that on an annual basis or semi-annually, we can go in and check the integrity of the structure below. But there'll be no active uses at this time on those levels. So that's how they're being mothballed.

will that mean that there won't be any more deterioration of the concrete or the rebar on P3 and P4?

That's correct. What's causing the deterioration is the interaction of water and moisture with the chemistry within the cement that's there in the rebar, and it causes a cathodic reaction, which then begins to corrode the rebar and the concrete. So our solution to solve that And some repairs have already occurred in the building. So we'll put down a waterproofing membrane, a fluid-applied waterproofer, so that those areas can get wet and any water that's there will drain to the drains and won't penetrate into the concrete and continue to cause any deterioration.

Okay, so it's a fairly extensive mothballing.

It sounds much more extensive than it is. It's really not that bad. I think part of the thing that sets us apart from the others is we took a more creative solution in order to protect the building and the upper structure and what approach to take with the lower two floors. So rather than doing way more than what was needed, we looked at what are our options and really kind of open up our thought process.

Looking at the overall planning, I like it because you have pulled the tower to the north. where in a previous solution, the tower was more at the intersection of the two streets. And I think it makes, when you look at the context that it's in, it works better with the Clayton on the Park building to the west, as well as to the government center to the east, running that building east-west. So I do like it. What it does, does opposite is it leaves two small parcels to the north going up to Rondelet, which will be in shadow. And who knows if they'll ever be redeveloped because they will be fairly small next to this. Anyway, I do like it. I think this rendering here shows what I'm talking about. It pulls everything together, not just what you're proposing, but also the adjacent city-owned garage and then the Clayton on the Park building also. Looking further, I find it interesting from what you were saying, Chris, about the location of the pool because it will be seen from the County Government Center. And normally we see our pools being a little bit more remote view from anything around it. So we'd like to see some comment about that. Also, I felt that as Ryan went through the planning ideas the eight that he enumerated uh I definitely agree with that uh Public Park may be being widened at the sidewalk uh maybe on an angle basis to draw more people in than what we're seeing right now also the retail component for a project of this size, I think we probably expected a little more retail in there. And we would suggest you take a look at that, not only at the quantity of square footage, but also the location. There was a comment about the garage facade on the south side. And I agree, I don't know what you can do with that, but having looked at it again today, it needs help.

The one thing that will occur is currently it's brick and there are some windows that go into the parking level and then a metal cladding that goes around the top, all of that metal cladding in our solution gets removed. I'm not sure what's underneath it. I think it's brick. Once we find that out, we'll have a better idea as to what we can do. If it's brick and it matches what's there, that's great. If we can find a brick that matches it, that would be good. But the metal cladding is going to go regardless.

And I agree Steve we got to we got to do something on that on that elevation and we will it's just it's just something we haven't addressed yet. But it's it's a big part of the building yeah

know it's 19 feet at at where it's nearest the city garage it's nine feet at the corner bottom, I mean it is a wall that exists and then it goes to six feet as it turns and goes north on merrimack so. As you look at it from the sky, it doesn't look like it's that much of a wall, but it is. It is a big part and how we treat it as a plinth I think is really important. I can see anything from doing some sort of green living wall on such a south facing, really create a nice environment there. But those are things we'll take a look at as we go, as we start really the next design phase.

Well, that wall also turns the corner and it becomes smaller and smaller on Beamiston. So hopefully it'll be a continuous design, but anyone walking on either of the two streets will really feel what is done with that wall. So very important. Looking at the more detail of the design, I actually like it. I like how the lower building is a much smaller scale grid and the larger building is a much larger scale grid. But the way I'm reading it is it's going to be very complimentary between the low building and the high building. I'm not sure about the south end of the low building, but I see what you're doing. It almost sets up a very simple facade, allowing everything else to look more prominent is what I'm reading.

That piece and the piece at the bridge, if you will, that connects the two buildings, they would be similar in how they're developed, those two pieces. So that's the thinking right now. And I, you know, it's, I haven't, it's not final by any stretch, even our own minds. So it's things we still want to examine and study as we develop the architecture further.

So what we see that you submitted on the west facade, you say looking west, but I think we're looking east.

Yeah. In reality. If you had the updated drawings, I corrected that.

Okay. um so that uh joint between the low and the high building would repeat on the east side also

yes yeah because it's all clear span there too by the way there's there's only two columns uh well, a column at the perimeter and then two columns right in the center, seven feet apart. And then the rest of it is clear span. So I'm really picking up and expressing that too and still got to develop that a little bit. But that piece that we see right now that is the connector between the two buildings is the kind of feeling that I was looking to express on the south end of the building. And it sits out away from the frame so it can fly by it.

I think I understand how they fit together better. When you're looking, I think you said the low building has eight foot floor to floor heights?

No, no. The parking, parking on the lowest level is only eight feet floor to floor. Barely meets code. You know, I mean, you scrape your head as you walk through it. Literally. The first, it's 15 feet and then it's 11 foot six floor to floor on levels two, three, four, and five. So they have a little higher floor to floor on those first five floors, and then we'll go to 10 feet as we go into the level six and above on the tower.

Okay, so you'll have 10 feet floor to floor. Will you be able to get nine foot finished ceiling? We'll

have probably an eight inch to 10 inch PT post-tension slab, so we'll have nine feet plus in the floor. In the living spaces, kitchen and bathrooms, we drop the ceilings for obvious reasons.

So a nine-foot nominal ceiling height is what you're aiming for. That seems to be what people are looking for nowadays.

The lower or occupied units will have

taller ceilings than that. And it'll all be exposed because it's a pan joy system so so, even though we have. 11 foot six Florida floor you basically have to the top of the pan 11 foot four there's only a two inch concrete piece between floors at the top of the Pan.

Okay. Let's talk about the roof. And I don't see any indication of mechanical equipment. Will it be hidden somewhere?

Well, again, you're talking about the low roof right now.

I'm talking about both.

Well, the tall building is going to have a penthouse, as you see there. And again, fortunately, the updated drawings didn't make it to you guys. But we incorporate the mechanical on the roof of the high-rise, which we're going to have the mechanical penthouse up there, which we'll have to have. And then on the low-rise, we're looking at how we can minimize the amount of equipment on that roof and how we'll screen it. Maybe not just a – because we're going to – it's a concern to us, every other building around us, but our high-rise is looking onto that roof as well. So we really want to do something more artful on that roof, and it's just something we have to develop yet because I think if we do treat the whole roof and then incorporate the mechanical into it, it can be more camouflaged, if you will, and it can be more interesting than just sticking a screen around a bunch of split windows

If you could talk into

the

microphone. This is the empty one.

So we definitely have to solve the low-rise building, the roof. The more of the compressors that we can look at locating between our building and the parking garage is what we want to do so we can minimize it up there. But we're going to have some on the roof of the low-rise, no doubt about it.

Thanks. Well, that leads me to the comment in the staff report about a more distinctive skyline-related active roof design instead of just a flat roof with some sort of mechanical up there. This will be very prominent in that area, and it seems like... something to crown it or uh say something different we'll leave that up to you could be very beneficial to the project all right we agree

we've talked about it we're going to do it um we just haven't we we do have an updated drawing but again it didn't make it and um uh But we're with you 100%. That building's got to have a terminus to it. And we want it to be iconic, if you will, and so people can locate it. It can be a landmark from around the city.

I think all of that also is a part of the evolution of the design based on your comments and then our own thoughts as we blend those two together.

Right. And as you know, this is only an interactive discussion between the applicant and the plan commission members. So the public will certainly have their say in future meetings. But let's come back down to the ground It looked to me like the loading dock area is really tight. I think we had, there was a plan, Ryan. Is what is called the existing dock, is that under the city garage? Yes, that's there. Okay.

And right this moment, it has two large vehicles parked into it, but they're completely pulled back in there, not protruding out into the alley. So the counties are the county's building.

Yeah. And then you're proposing two more docks. and then a generator for your buildings. But of course, you're giving up the alley that's going through there right now. So how are they going to jockey these larger delivery vehicles?

Well, those docks that are under the existing city garage are about 30 feet deep. So most of your delivery vehicles that are, and those are going to make deliveries primarily to the low rise buildings. So we're going to have 40, roughly 40 units that those serve. And we have our own, we have a trash chute on that side as well. So all the movement from that existing dock area would come across yellow into those two elevators and then serve the building up plus the trash receptacle that's going to be at the base of the trash chute.

One of the things that we did in looking at this is if we looked at at 212 and Clayton on the park, and both of those from the alley into their loading dock area are basically 90 degree turns so any large truck that is in that 24 foot alley has to turn 90 degrees in order to back in. So we have the opportunity here where if we come from the north down the alley, and are you going to get a 53-foot wide truck in there? No, but I don't think you are anywhere within these alleys. But you will be able to take a fairly good-sized truck, make the turn to the west, and have the option either to back straight into the new docks or come in at an angle when there's multiple people moving in and use the two existing docks.

I mean, having four docks is a healthy number for a building this size. And most of the move in, move out is going to happen on weekends. So how the dock master, how we manage that, I think is very viable the way. And we have plenty of room for one very long trailer or long truck to go in there. Again, maneuvering the streets of downtown Clayton. But we feel pretty comfortable with it, Steve.

Well, I'm sure Public Works will take a look at that when they look at the documents. While we're on this drawing, am I reading at the far left end just inside P1 and P2 entrances? Is that a ramp?

Well, that's a vault. Currently, the transformer and the switchgear that serve that building sit in that vault area.

No, just to

the right of it. That's a ramp between P2 and P3. It does not exist at P1.

Oh, okay. So then P1 could enter off of Bonham or go out the alley. That's right. Correct. But P2 would only have access to Bonham. Correct. That's correct.

And right now, just so you know, there's 200 cars that are parked in that building or could be parked in the building. That's what it served at one time. And we will have between now these three different entry exits will be, we're going to have roughly 140 cars, 144 cars.

for the roughly 250 units.

Yes, because we also have parking in the city garage. That lease has been signed and entered into record.

I had one other question on my list and then we'll move on. And that was about the art canopy. Yes. Would it have any color as we see in another building?

I think it definitely could have color. This one's in Mexico, and it says Anger out of Kansas City built this canopy. I mean, I think as we evolve kind of the brand of the building, everything is happening on that plaza, how we surface the exterior wall, that plinth that we talked about, it certainly could have color. There's something pretty nice about the way white and shadows play off one another. So I thought it was a great precedent, but we haven't made a decision about that at all.

Could you, do you have the pointer or Ryan? I think you have the pointer, right? Oh, I've got it. Oh, you do have it. Okay. That doesn't, oh no. Okay. Could you describe where that canopy is? I don't see where it goes.

See that art canopy right there. It's right there along the pool and then it turns the corner. and embraces really the, you know, that south side of the plaza there. And there's these trees, these existing trees that are there, really quite nice. To be able to keep those would be terrific. If you go by there and see them, they're healthy trees. And I think, well, I should say, I think they're healthy. They look healthy. I just had a 70-foot tree blow over that I thought was healthy in my yard. So... Need somebody smarter than I to really say that they're healthy.

Well, Carolyn will certainly take a look at that. That's who I was looking at. Okay. Thank you for that, Art Canopy. I totally missed it. I thought it was running around the building. Oh, okay. But that will then give a little more visual protection to the pool.

Correct.

Correct.

Not only, yes, it'll give that both just the comfort level, I think, from people looking down from the courts buildings. but also how we kind of anchor and highlight that corner. Because we do have the existing plinth or the existing parking there, to be able to do something more artful on that corner seemed like it made a lot of sense to us. So it works in a couple different capacities, how that canopy would work.

Speaking of art, there's an art piece right near the top of the building. Yes. Could you elaborate a little more on that? Because we've gone through art on high-rise buildings with you before. Yes. And? And I'm waiting to hear your comment on this one.

All right, so the updated sketch really, it doesn't close at the top of that notch, if you will, where that green element is. And that element would project up above the roof line. So you'd have really, it would be complimented either side by the tower that extends up and then that would extend above that and then it would be lit. So what that material is and what that piece is, we haven't decided yet but it's the opportunity to provide something there significant. I think that becomes sky art and not just ground art.

So if I heard you correctly, it would go above the horizontal at the roofline. Yes. So it could actually become part of the distinctive roof, whatever. I don't mean this, but whatever. then it sort of becomes a logo or a sign of its own for the building.

I think that's, you could certainly call it that, yeah. I think a logo might, I mean, I do want it to be, I think it should be more artful than a branding piece.

Well, I was going to say it shouldn't be a sign.

Yeah, correct. That says hope on it right now. I just, I borrowed it from the love. If you look at it really closely, it says H-O-P-E. I can't tell.

But we'll see another one that's anyway. Okay, I was thinking a disco

ball. We'll talk about that later. Okay, thank you. I apologize to all the other members I've talked too long, but Carolyn you want to jump in.

Goodness, besides the comments from the city. Hi, by the way. Hi. The comments from the city and the comments that he always takes away from the rest of the group here. Sometimes I wish we'd start at that

end. We may need to do that.

Yeah, it's okay. Okay. I'm going to start with the pocket park. And you made one of the comments, I think. this is one of those situations where I just want to draw, but

And I did.

Um, but having stairs that are a bit larger coming up into that park, as opposed to just on the side of it, I think might make it more seem like it's part of the community. I

that they can go because otherwise they're going to think that's not for us. Right. That'd be

fairly easy to

do.

Yeah. Yeah. Just something, I mean, it can be artfully done. I mean, um, And then some of the, I'm sure you're going to work on the landscape a lot more.

Absolutely.

But just a small comment, the landscape screen between Merrimack and the buildings two foot wide, you're not going to get much effect there. So, but you'll also have the streetscape as well, but hopefully something can happen there. And that goes around the building. That's pretty tiny. Why could you not stop at 20 for the penthouse?

Why did we buy it?

Why couldn't you stop at 20 floors and the penthouse is the 20th floor?

Oh, well, because of the unit count that we wanted to get as we were going. We got our market analysis back. It changed our unit count, our unit sizes for the current market in Clayton. And as we did that, so the units got a little bit larger. And so we wanted to make sure we were right at that 300 unit number.

Some of those units, the studio ones are pretty tiny, 600 feet per feet. Wow. But that's okay. Studio, right? Okay. I just wanted to ask that. Now you were talking about your Florida floor.

Yes.

What is the penthouse Florida floor?

On the penthouse floor up there, I went to 13 feet on the penthouse level.

That makes me smile because, yeah. And parking space ratio was a question, but that was answered. I like the piece between the buildings here. The connector. I think that really could become like a jewel in the center of them and still connect, but also like have a, I don't want to say overglow or anything, but something to it that makes it seem special, you know?

Agreed. Like a

cool notch. And I'm sorry, your most current drawings are not here because I saw that was one of my questions. I had one 1523 circle here and I'm like, what?

So I think that's fine. The art mural, I have a question about that. So the one at the top, who actually can see that? Like right now, a bird is looking at it.

well i you know i was driving down uh i was driving east on highway 40 and as i turned in 170 i saw i saw the uh um clayton on the park i saw the commerce tower building i mean you can see it there's no doubt about it from that distance

but a pedestrian probably wouldn't even know it was there

uh probably well i think as you're if you were on you know if you're on merrimack walking north you're going to see that there's no doubt I mean, it looked like an opportunity. It can be something more benign, but I just saw it as an opportunity to be something. I'm just

curious who could see it because sometimes people put cool things on and then it's kind of like, well, that didn't work. My other questions, I think Steve, are you considering a green roof on the lower building?

uh well again i think that's part of the artful solution we want to do just because we have to look down onto it so i'm not sure what that is yet we've got a

could be something though

yeah

it doesn't have to be all green i'm saying it could be an outdoor somehow another space or something but um the commercial uh the community retail i agreed with steve on that that's too small it'd be nice to have it on more edges than just the one corner um just because people these are pretty highly trafficked and it's and bringing in this much residential is going to bring in the need for restaurants and cafes and things like that.

I think ideally, yeah, a food element there, food and beverage, cafe kind of thing would be great with outdoor seating, and it could be terrific.

I think that's all I had besides the parking. Oh, yeah, going down Bonham as you're heading to Shaw Park, I was thinking that looking at this drawing on here, it's not numbered but this one yeah looking at this one um it seems like with the the garage entrances somehow maybe you know creating landscape that goes a little bit further on the other side of the i do this without drawing it's really annoying um but the area that you have a little box drawn at the corner

the building and bottom um Maybe if that was landscape, it would continue and make the street as opposed to. A few trees

absolutely and we actually talked about about sorry didn't mean to

actually

talked about some areas there that could be kind of many parts, you know the master plan talk about a pocket park at central and bottom but that doesn't look like that's going to happen anytime soon and so. As we enhance, I think that transition from Central and down to Shaw Park just to make it as green and feel good as possible is something we definitely want to make sure happens. Plus, it helps dress that south end of the podium.

Yeah. Because the other thing, when you pass that, you're not looking at anything really that pretty.

Right.

That was all I

have. Thank you.

Richard?

um yeah i mean i before just so i don't forget um you know we talked about you know lighting up the building or making it i would just also be cognizant of the fact that you've got two other buildings really close by so don't light it up too much otherwise i'll get a lot of emails from residents whose lights are flashing in there you know clayton on the park and 212 so i would just when you're doing something distinctual with your building, just also be aware. Yes, and Park Tower, yes. So there's just many other buildings nearby. So I would just be aware of where the lights are going and that they're not too bright. I hope that, like you've said, we've talked a lot about this art mural at the top, but making it something that's attractive that obviously doesn't shine too brightly or something like that. So just as you're designing something, be aware of led lights and making sure they're not too bright for your neighbors

okay

um i do really like the design of the building in the sense that i know everybody i know on this board and i'm sure on the board of alderman will appreciate that it will look differently than just a glass box that's kind of what i think a lot of people have talked about that i love all the cutouts and i love how it looks different on each part of the building so i think you guys did a great job um I just had a couple of questions. What is the multi-use court? Is that just like a basketball court that'll be available or maybe pickleball?

Pickleball is all the rage now, but it could be, it wants to be multi-use so it can change over time. So it's a sport court that can have different activities on it.

That's inside, that's all inside. No, that's outside. Oh, that's all outside. Okay, that's not, okay. And then... you know, I just think something that often comes up, especially as you're looking at PUDs is will you, will there be lead certification related to any of them? So, so I just think that's an important thing as we, you know, look at your PUDs and the public benefits. I know just sustainability is important to all of us. Yeah. You know, Carolyn asked about the green roof, whether it's a green roof, a blue roof, something, you know, just to improve water is a constant problem all the time. So figuring out how to take care of it in that area. Will you provide public parking anywhere in the building or? It just might be something to think about for the retail establishment.

It would be over in their city's garage next door.

And then I would just also make sure that as you're designing the parking garages, that there's EV charging capabilities. Again, something that I know the Board of Aldermen will look at if this project did impact anything. gets to the Board of Aldermen. So I'm trying to think, I think that's it. You know, I think it, as you guys, I do also love the art canopy. I like the idea of making it, of having it stay white. I think the shadow would look really nice. And, you know, I think it's, I commend you guys for taking on this project. It's been an eyesore for as long as I've lived in St. Louis or Clayton, 12 years now. So it's great that we're trying to find a way to at least preserve the building in a way that makes it financially sustainable. you know, um, yeah, financially viable for a developer to actually, you know, cause I know people have talked about trying to raise it. And so, um, so anyways, so yeah, I, I commend you for taking it on and kind of look forward to seeing what the plans continue to evolve as. So

thank you.

I think, I mean, it's certainly something we want to look at and we've talked about already. I think to Caroline's point, as we rotate, if you will, the access to the pocket park, you know, so it really feels like it's part of the sidewalk experience. And then how it then transitions around the arcade because we have to have a ramp that comes up to that plaza level. And that ramp runs in front of that leasing center right now. And so we're flat, though, because the way the grades work, we're flattened where we show the purple. Where we show it right now, we can come out on right out to the sidewalk with Sidewalk Cafe. We can't do that anywhere else. We'll be elevated. So it won't engage the street.

that's kind of the reason for its location so you know we've got to kind of sort those things out as we develop things a little bit further and i mean we have not addressed other than notes and and a feel you know really start to design the whole street experience which is really important you got to make people feel good as they're walking along there and be engaged

I think one of the challenges is with this particular site is the amount of slope that occurs from north to south, and then going east to west is quite a bit. And as soon as you solve one problem or you try and move the community area and retail next to the pocket park, you've now created another problem that you've got to solve. And we've looked at that several different ways. One thing that we felt was important was to have that leasing center at the front door for the residents and security for them. And we looked at swapping that with the community park or with the community retail, and then it becomes a little bit too separated. And I think it's definitely something that we're going to continue to look at and try and get it as best we can to what you're asking

have the same questions of ourselves.

truly

yeah and that's why we had that ramp you see the area just below the leasing center there's a green um park there's a green

yeah

kind of area Between those two, that ramp slopes from the sidewalk level up to the raised plaza level.

know

And just to put your mind at ease that our canopy, it already sits up about seven feet, seven and a half feet above the sidewalk level. It'll go up another eight to 10 feet above that. It'll be up there. So you'll really see it from the street too. Not going to have to duck your head then.

or well actually we're right over that green if you see it we're right at the edge of our property line I mean we might project over and I can it's just the way I drew it if we have to push it back and but everything else is out towards the curb and the signal lights at the corner um we'll look at all that just to make sure

Well, okay I show it notch by the point that the fact of the matter is, we do have it's about 10 feet back right now. But that space right there isn't used by anybody and so depending on what that what the materiality of that is it can be brought out, it can go, it can project up but. I'm telling you, anybody going north on Merrimack is going to see that element. And we can actually do it. We'll put it in the computer. I think we can show you

some sight lines so that you have a better idea of where you'll see it and where you won't.

So I'm in agreement with a lot of people on the side. And it's funny because I had a big start about pedestrian experience and then you took that one. But I do think it would be important like when you come back to, you know, to get like, you know, that Merrimack elevation and, you know, the South elevation to really... you know, for public benefit to really understand like what that pedestrian experience is. Um, cause it is, it's a, it's a giant mall and even like a five foot, you know, that's pretty at eye level for most people. So I think that's a tricky thing to kind of figure out. Um, I mean, just compliments. I think it's very cool that you're keeping that building and the first five floors. I think that's a really, I mean, from green lead standpoint, that's phenomenal. I think that great. I love the tower. I like the idea of having it look two different skims or whatever on it. I think that really interesting concept for that, but I don't have too much to add, but overall I like it.

I was transferring their comments to you. I knew you were going to say that.

I had a question. Yes, again, I had to draw something. What if the commercial was in these two portions here? The offices move here, the leasing moves off of the lobby. That way you get that onto your entity and it's a lot more room for the retail too.

so just

look at that we also got to think about deliveries and people coming to the building and security and and how we get uh people in and out but i think that's something we'll caroline will definitely uh

david My only question would be about affordable housing. So we've seen a couple units in our last two projects that went through the PUD process, and there was one that was approved. That was at the Sterling Bank Tower that's down the street that recently got approval, and then we have a mixed-use building that was approved at the corner of Merrimack and Pershing, and they set aside two units for... individuals that meet the 80 percent of median household income and then 30 percent of that, the way you typically set it up. Is that anything you've considered for this particular project?

We have, and it'll be a component of this as we go through our numbers. We'll be able to determine better exactly how many we have, but I can commit to at least two, but I think we could probably do more than that.

Sounds good. I know that question will come up, so

Chris, I had only one other thing on the sheet that looks more like a sketch. I guess it's level six through 20. Yes. Is the building actually? Yeah, there. Is the building actually going to be angled on the west end?

I had stair-stepped it. And then as I started developing the elevations and looking at it, I thought it could be a little stronger to have it as a bevel versus a stair-step. So I'm in the process of determining that for sure. The initial reaction from other folks is they like the bend in the building versus the stair-step. Yeah.

yeah um i like the bevel and i like that there's a little notch

that it um it is a smooth

yeah agreed with you if you notice i even moved it a little bit further just to get the structural lines and then you know the structure is gonna gonna evolve too yeah

Will anyone else on the plan commission have any other comments or questions? Do you have anything for us?

We look

forward

to coming back and showing you

what we just wanted to say that Michael night. Revive capital is on the he couldn't make it here because he's finalizing some documents, but he's very committed to lead his the commerce tower and Kansas City which he redeveloped 39 stories was lead gold if not platinum I know it was gold for sure it could have been platinum so. to your point and the lead question, there is that commitment there. And he's dying to get moving on this. We just talked right before the meeting. He says, let's get her done and make it happen. So he's very excited about this project and working with you all and bringing this corner back to the city, bringing it back to life.

Well, it's been a dead corner for a couple decades, it seems, and we're ready to see it move forward. So we applaud you for taking the challenge, and we look forward to you returning again.

Thanks

appreciate

Thanks very much!

exhausts our agenda for tonight. Kami, any further comments?

Ellen?

Bridget?

Yep. Anna? So you all have postcards. I put them at your seats that are advertising some upcoming projects engagement events for our comprehensive plan, Clayton Tomorrow. I also have lots of postcards our consultants dropped off, so if you would like any others to distribute or place around the city, just let Ryan or myself know. I think Ryan put a few out by the back door, but we have our first open house on August, or yes, August 2nd from four to seven come and go anytime between that. It's not a presentation set up. So we'll be, that'll be over at the center of Clayton. We've also started distributing some yard signs throughout the city with the same advertisements. So really want to get a lot of attendees at these events. So please spread the word to everybody to show up.

Ana, do you have... I know we got an email about the yard signs. Do you feel like you've gotten enough distribution? I mean, do you feel like... I guess, do you need people to... You know, there's some prominent corners in Davis Place or Clayton Gardens. I mean, do need... You need me to find places to put the yard signs. I

feel like we've

gotten-

We have, so we placed some strategically so far within right of way. The goal then, we were gonna also give one to all the elected officials to put in your yards as well as members of the steering committee. So the places that we've chosen so far to put them out are neighborhoods that don't have either an elected official or a steering committee member living in that neighborhood. So if you, I know there's a, we have a few in that category that fall in a couple of neighborhoods. So we've got a few in Davis place. So Steve, if you take your sign, instead of putting it in your yard, you want to put it in a more prominent location within Davis place or same with you feel free to do that. But as of right now, that reserves a few more for us to fill in holes if we need it based on that distribution.

Sounds good. Well, I guess just let us know.

Yeah. If you want to pick yours up right now, we have them downstairs.

Is there any comment on the engage Clayton about people responding to it or looking at

it? We have been getting a good number of hits to the website and I did notice over the weekend. So the first rounds of yard signs were placed on Friday and then some more today. And we did get an increase in, I think we got maybe four or five, kind of idea notes placed on the website since doing that. So that's positive. The online survey portion of the engagement is set to be placed on engagedclayton.com by the end of the month. So right now, people just go to the website to learn some stuff. And as we put the dates of the engagement but there isn't as much interaction back and forth with the community but starting by the end of the month once we have that survey up then hopefully through all of these advertisements we'll we'll start to get some good response rates on that as well

okay any word on what we're seeing at our next meeting which would be what august something

Yeah, there's a little bit of time between this meeting and the next one. There's a couple things that could come out at this point. I can't really say because it's either going to be light or it's all going to show up at the same time. So we'll find out in

the next week. Because there's the way the dates fall. This is one of those times where we will, right? So we'll have the, you know, there's one extra Monday in July. So that's, we don't know all the responses yet.

Well, thank you. Thank you, everyone. And we'll look forward to seeing you in about three weeks.