October 21, 2022 — Meeting Transcript

We've got Anna, Karen. Bridget should be calling in too. Right. We're broadcasting, but she hasn't called in yet, right? I don't know who TP is. Okay, thank you. Oh, okay, great. No. Sorry. That's all right. We'll just talk it through. Okay, so it looks like we have

everyone on the board that's going to attend today. There's Bridget.

Great. Hey, Bridget.

Okay.

This is a tough time for people who have kids in school.

Well, she gets to look at the document on a phone, so that'll be fun.

Oh, yeah.

All right, so this is a continuation of the discussion that we had prior to the board meeting last time. So we had a six o'clock discussion and we went through the survey as staff had drafted it. And so there were a bunch of comments that were received and those were incorporated into this draft. The other thing that's happened since then is we met with a consultant that specializes in political polling and surveys and had them look at the information as well to make sure that the survey is going to yield the type of information we're looking for to help us make decisions as they relate to the waste collection contracts. So the draft that we're going to be looking at today incorporates those changes, as well as a couple highlighted items that take into account some comments that were received from Alderman Gary Feder, who can't be here today. So we'll talk through those as well. And then as we move and progress through the document, if anyone has any questions, comments, concerns, anything you'd like to change in here, then we'll talk through it and hopefully refine this and ultimately get a go-no-go as far as whether or not we're doing a survey. If we are going to send out the written survey, we had a meeting today with ETC, who is the firm we'll use to do the statistically significant survey, and their timeline is still 10 to 12 weeks. And if we said go on Monday and had this ready to go, we're looking at about three to four weeks before it's going to hit mailboxes. So that gives us time to draft that letter and get it out to all residents in advance of the survey hitting.

All right, so this is a continuation of the discussion that we had prior to the board meeting last time. So we had a six o'clock discussion and we went through the survey as staff had drafted it. And so there were a bunch of comments that were received and those were incorporated into this draft. The other thing that's happened since then is we met with a consultant that specializes in political polling and surveys and had them look at the information as well to make sure that the survey is going to yield the type of information we're looking for to help us make decisions as they relate to the waste collection contracts. So the draft that we're going to be looking at today incorporates those changes, as well as a couple highlighted items that take into account some comments that were received from Alderman Fader, who can't be here today. So we'll talk through those as well. And then as we move and progress through the document, if anyone has any questions, comments, concerns, anything you'd like to change in here, then we'll talk through it and hopefully refine this and ultimately get a go-no-go as far as whether or not we're doing a survey. If we are going to send out the written survey, we had a meeting today with ETC, who is the firm we'll use to do the statistically significant survey, and their timeline is still 10 to 12 weeks. And if we said go on Monday and had this ready to go, we're looking at about three to four weeks before it's going to hit mailboxes. So that gives us time to draft that letter and get it out to all residents in advance of the survey hitting.

So it's going to all residents? Well, it'll

go to a random sample of residents that have single family or two family units. So condos won't be...

Okay. Okay.

So this is the survey proposed at this point, right? I just want to be clear about what we're talking about. And because really the primary decision we will have to make will be rear yard or curbside for one and two family homes. The suggestion is to limit the distribution of the life statistically valid paper survey to those addresses, right? The one question I have about that is that we actually have two questions on here, right? We have the rear yard and curbside, and then we have the question about yard waste. Correct. And the yard waste question would apply to all residences, not just single and two families. Is that fair to say? I

do not believe that we would provide yard waste services for multifamily

properties. So I was told that we do now when I asked about it some time ago, but I don't know if that is true. Up to four

units?

I don't know. I asked you once when I noticed like my friends in a six unit didn't have that, didn't have any yardways. And I was wondering if they could or not. And I thought the answer at the time was that they could, but they just didn't. So that would be probably just good to clarify. I don't know if

they would need to contract separately for that.

Yeah. I mean, I'm not, I'm not saying at this point we need to change. I'm not, proposing we need to change how this is distributed. But I just wanted to be clear about the two things we're getting information about and who they

impact. So we are not providing yard waste collection for all the multifamily in the city. I know for a fact that isn't happening now. They can contract for that additional service if they're servicing their own property there.

Okay.

But I don't believe we provided for all the multiffamily in the city. So I'll verify that Matt is out. next week, but I will check the contract again.

Thank

you. So as far as this particular survey and the reason it's going to single family only is as Alderwoman Patel had mentioned, the only questions we're asking relate to whether we have rear yard service going forward or the curbside service for single family homes. And then whether or not yard waste is included in the monthly fee that residents would pay, or if it's an optional service that would be an additional charge for those residences. On multifamily, the city will negotiate with the contracted hauler for a variety of dumpster sizes, roll-off carts, those types of things, so that each individual building has a competitively bid rate that they can utilize and contract directly with the hauler to provide that service.

If she's... Cheryl, yeah, and

you live at-

And we would, if you could-

Actually, can you do it- Yeah, if you've got a question, if you could

use the mic. It just

automatically goes into our record. So

you'll want to hit that button where it says push. It'll turn green.

Cheryl Miller, 130B North Central Avenue.

Thank you.

So if I understand correctly, then multifamily units will be responsible for negotiating- with your help directly to the trash haulers? Is that what you're saying?

No, that you won't negotiate. We'll do that part. So we'll competitively bid all the multifamily in the city. So you have this economy of scale that you won't be able to achieve trying to negotiate for just your building. So we'll set rates out for different dumpster sizes, for instance, or if they have containers, what it costs to get the waste serviced. As far as the individual billing, that will be set up directly with the hauler. So a bill will come to either, and it depends on the building because every multifamily building is going to be different. Either the property owner, if there's an HOA or a board of trustees that receives those bills, that's who it would go to. Or in some instances, there's a property management company that takes care of the bills that come in. So each of the multifamily properties is going to be a little bit different, but the city is going to competitively bid the rates for that waste collection service.

Okay, great. Thank you.

Thank you. Okay, any questions about those? The distinction between single family or and multifamily what we're trying to achieve there. Any questions before we get started going through the survey?

I give a general question just on

yard waste. How do we If people are used to having the

yard waste handled by the city, if people aren't taking care of their yard waste, what do we see happening if we don't continue yard waste that the city contracted?

The city will still provide leaf collection six times a year. So that's a service we already provide. So they put their leaves at the curb, we'll come by and pick those up. But as for everything else that falls the rest of the year and sticks and everything else, they will be responsible for getting those off of their property. And so if they don't, then it's a code enforcement issue.

And how do we see that happening? Are you putting it in their trash or?

They can't put it in their trash either. If they do, they'll get some kind of oops letter from the hauler. So they'll need to make other arrangements. And we do have residents. And one of the reasons she asked the question, you have an optional, if they have certain yard services, You know, they'll come in and take it away for you. So they don't actually bag anything themselves and set it out. So that's, you know, there is that potential that we'll have people that won't want to opt in because their yard waste services or their yard service is taken care of.

But again, that will be a citywide decision. It won't be by residents.

No, so we

will. So the question.

So we will decide whether to make it a standard service that all like once and we may or may not be able to get bids both ways. And like we will decide that. And then if if we decide to make it optional, then people will opt in or opt out. Right.

That is correct.

We could decide we want to maintain this because it's a level of service we've had that we want to continue and whatever reasons.

Yeah. If everybody says they want it to remain standard, then we need to probably do that.

Yeah.

And you may have people that don't have mature trees in their yard. It's a newer property. They don't have much yard waste that they create. Or you might have others that have a service that come and take it away. And I can see those individuals maybe saying, I'd rather have it be optional than standard because I won't utilize the service. But I would say for most of us, with the number of trees we have in this city, most people are going to want to see that included. Or if it's optional, they're going to utilize it.

It's a good question because I can tell you what a couple of people that live near me do. They drag their yard waste out to the center island and hope that the city will pick it up. And eventually, I guess we do. That's

just something we'll have to monitor and enforce around the city if that starts to happen. Okay, any other general questions before we get into the survey? All right, if not, one of the first changes that was made was, and they suggested this and we thought it was a good one, was right up front, in bold, go ahead and talk about the decision to turn the costs for waste collection services over to residents. Say, we'll no longer cover this. And one of the biggest reasons for it is it gets your attention right away. So we send out a lot of correspondence and we send out surveys and things. We're always worried about whether or not people are actually going to read the material or if they're just going to say, ah, it's just another survey. I don't want to take it. If you read that when you open it right away, it's, oh, okay, well, something big is happening here. And I should probably read this to figure out what's going on with it.

I'm wondering if we should also put something on the outside of the envelope. Right, yeah. That says, oh, hi, Bridget.

I

wonder where did that voice come from? I'm sorry,

but I was going to say the same thing. I just think we have to put something on the inside of the envelope. Like this is about your trash. Please read. I mean, of course it can be said more eloquently than that, but I think there needs to be something on the outside

That's great.

As service is changing. Right, yes, exactly. Something to really grab them and have them not recycle

it. We'll figure out some language for that. That's something we can do. And again, we're going to send a letter out in advance of surveys even going out. So hopefully if they read that letter, which also should have a heading that makes it really clear what's going on. If they read that when a survey comes a couple weeks later, then hopefully they know they read the first correspondence. They know, hey, I might be one of those houses that gets one.

Yeah.

David, I know I'm jumping a little bit but it relates to what you did on this first sentence. In the first, second, third, fourth paragraph you have a line in there that says that waste collection has become the focal point of these discussions. It seems as though you've basically eliminated that as a comment at the end of this preliminary section here because of your first line.

That's an interesting point, Ira. And I wonder if... So understanding now... that there's going to be a letter and the survey. And granted, at the moment folks are reading the survey, they won't have the letter necessarily, and they may or may not have actually read the letter when it came to them. Keeping all that in mind, some of this information about why we made the decision may not be relevant to the survey. especially since the survey is really going to a subset of folks. And so it could be an opportunity to shorten it. i don't know agree i go

ahead go ahead just a thought i'm

not advocating as to

hat solves

it

yeah saying has to hit i mean i think i made a little change in that paragraph could just say

became

that you'll see when we get okay but um yeah that's become had become or or it became it became

And a lot of this is going to be redundant with the letter, but again, we're doing that just in case people read that first letter and then they get the survey. We want to reinforce this. So we're going to reinforce it through Clayton connections and city views and every channel we have to try to get people to read it at least once and understand what's happening and why those decisions were made.

So the timing of this and the letter, um, Well, what I'm concerned about is that this gives, that first bullet is the most important thing. The trash collection is coming to you. And if it's not going to multifamily, you want them to be just as on top of things as single family. So the timing of getting- The letter

goes out to everyone.

Yes, at the same time. So that'll be

single family

before. Yeah, so

a letter will go out and that probably goes out two and a half weeks from now or so that it would hit mailboxes. So we'd be ready to go with that next week. Everyone with a residence would receive it and then selected residences would receive the survey a couple of weeks after that.

And we'll also be fielding that online thing.

And then you also have city views hitting in December or so?

Okay. So that line, they strongly suggested we move it to the top. And again, we were in agreement And then we're still telling the story pretty much the way we were through these first four paragraphs here without a lot of change. One suggesting Gary Feder had as it relates to the fund balance, the city has a policy that requires at least, he wanted to add that language, 25% of annual operating expenses to be maintained and reserved. So that's one of the few revisions that has been made on this section of the document. Are there any questions or concerns with anything there? Now we'll scroll down to these bullets.

Okay. So that line, they strongly suggested we move it to the top. And again, we were in agreement And then we're still telling the story pretty much the way we were through these first four paragraphs here without a lot of change. One suggesting Gary Fader had as it relates to the fund balance, the city has a policy that requires at least, he wanted to add that language, 25% of annual operating expenses to be maintained and reserved. So that's one of the few revisions that has been made on this section of the document. Are there any questions or concerns with anything there? Now we'll scroll down to these bullets.

Well, hang on. I have a suggestion on the paragraph over the past two years. So my suggestion is, first of all, when we say, okay, because it represents 7% of our annual expenditures, first of all that's redundant because it's also mentioned down below, but that's not why we're doing this. We're not doing it just because it's 7% of our expenditures. We're doing it because for a number of reasons, which are all listed down below. And I like the thing about waste collection. So I would delete because it represents blah, blah, expenditures and then just say waste collection became the focal point of these discussions for a number of reason. And then you've got all those bullet points. And I would make So to make that make more sense, I would take the last three bullet points and move them over to be like the two above them, just format-wise. Because those are all reasons, in my opinion.

Yeah, I like that better. I just think move these over here.

Yeah, make them like those other bullet points.

Above it?

Yeah.

Well, those two correspond directly to the item above. So we talk about, we've traditionally covered the cost of all these things. And then we say we're the only city that covers the cost of both of those items. This next item.

I mean,

the contract, I don't know if it's a subset of that first bullet.

To me, it's okay. The reason we're considering, we went to a waste collection is A, we're the only City in the Metro area that does it. be for a single or multi, then this is a big chunk of money. It represents a big chunk of 2.2 million, which is over 7% of our annual expenses. So that's a reason why we look at trash. We have an opportunity, and so this is a change I made. The city has an opportunity to renegotiate the current contract with the public, which expires September 30th.

I don't know that we want to say that, though, because we're not renegotiating the contract. We're bidding out a whole new scope of services.

Which allows us to bid for a new scope of services? Can you just

say we have an opportunity to rebid the service because our contract expires? Otherwise, we don't have an opportunity to re-bid. And then we also think costs are going to go up on this. So those are all, to me, reasons why we are looking at trash. So that's what I would say. So that's why I would move those over to be like the number one and number two little hollow bullets and make them all hollow bullets except for the first sentence.

Mayor, I think the first three, like the first one with its subsets is designed to say like, we're unique in how we have provided this service. That's one of the reasons we're considering changing it. The second is because of the cost. The third is because we have the opportunity because the contract is changing. And the fourth is because it's going to actually go up even a lot more, we think than what it is today. So, like,

like one, a, b, two, three.

Okay, does that I don't I mean I

it doesn't matter that much. You know, we could, we could say the city of Clayton has traditionally covered and we're the only city that still does it. I mean that would even don't even need those two.

Yeah, so remember we really talked about, we didn't say traditionally, I think originally folks wanted to add that. And so then we did the only part as sub bullets. So that's why we broke it out.

And I guess what you're saying is this still communicates that they are all reasons why.

Minor point, waste is a focal point. It's not a versus was. And can you remind me too, it says that we're the only one that does backyard pickup and we're one of the few that does general collection from the operating budget, right?

So we're the only ones that covers the cost of the rear yard services. There are a few others that have it but the city doesn't pay for it.

Right, but I'm just trying to remember how many actually do a more basic service that's covered from their general fund. I mean, I remember somebody has a separate. On the curb side, there

are still a number that do the curbside service, right? Okay.

The

other questions or comments on the bullets?

You know, David, you had said at one point you were a little bit nervous about broadcasting our position to Republic. And I'm just thinking out loud here, you're saying it's anticipated the cost of the next waste collection contract will significantly increase. Does that not give them permission to significantly increase? I'm asking you because you're more...

Interesting.

I mean, we

can take out the word significantly. We do know it's going to increase.

I think significantly gives them a lot of permission and I would not want to give them that.

Yeah, we can take that particular word out. I mean, there's no doubt that it's going to decrease. Right, I

can

go with increase. But we can pull out significant.

Right.

Okay,

that's a good point.

Thank you. Thanks.

And I just, I guess it's implied, but that bullet point right above it, and you've added about there'll be competitively bid, but the point I was trying to make is that we now have an opportunity to do that.

Yeah. So which provides the opportunity for us to change the scope of services. That's really what it is. Like if we didn't have a contract expiring, we wouldn't be able to make this change. Right. And the timing is what's a lot like, like we can't wait two years and decide whether to do this because this is when the contract is available. This is when the opportunity is here for us to change our scope of

services. As it was because otherwise it's going to be

Or just something like two sentences, like after 2023, say as a result, you can say like, as a result, there will be a new opportunity for new services, whatever. But, you know, separating those two ideas out. But I mean, however you want to do, but, you know, I think it's kind of two separate ideas

now. It's short.

Yeah. You could just say the city has an opportunity to bid a new scope of services because our current contract expires September 30th. Yeah,

I mean, that's what he has, but just in the other order. Okay, got it.

Yeah. That

implies you're staying with the public.

That's fine. I mean, you could just say the current contract expires and not even say with Republic. Because we don't have a position on whether it will be Republic or not, right? We are establishing the services we want, and we're going to go to bid for that. Yeah.

Right. We

want people to know that we're going to do that. Okay. Questions or comments on the bullets?

What do you think about removing with Republic Services? Do you think it's important to keep it there?

We can say the current contract.

Yeah, I mean, I'm just to cut where

we can. It shortens it. We'll probably need to be clear. Okay. i'm uh are

we going down to the next little paragraph then

this year

yeah

yes we can

so one thought maybe it's in here somewhere but we need to say that we're doing this on a city-wide basis somewhere and this might be a place where we could or do we already say that

it's been added right here on number one oh that was one of gary's comments

okay so i i've got I hadn't seen that. I mean, I saw his comments, but I didn't know that you had put it in. Yeah, that was one of the items I

incorporated.

Perfect.

That's all I had on that.

There are no other comments on that. We'll get into the choices here. So the next decision of scope of services for single family and two family units, we will utilize survey data when determining the scope. And then we get into the actual questions. So the big change here, this wording was changed a little bit. So taking into account the considerations presented below, should Clayton's next citywide contract for trash and recycling be for curbside or rear yard collection? And then rather than have a list of bullets like we did previously, there's a table here. And it's not necessarily pros and cons. It's kind of pros and cons for a little bit and then additional information. on the curbside side of the table, but really just trying to lay out again those key facts and this incorporates the things that were discussed when we went through those bullets. So one of the things that Becky had brought up on the very first one here was that we do have residents that currently may lease some of their containers from Republic be it recycling or trash. I know that's not the case with all of the retainers and that's why I added that particular word. Do you

think that's true?

What I

know is if you need a new trash container now, they tell you to just go buy one. They don't require or even offer the opportunity to purchase one from them. So I think the key to my feedback is that this first row on the left side combines two different ideas in one section. So we're talking about the fact that we'll be purchasing or leasing. How will we get our containers? And then what will the service look like, right? The second sentence is what will the service looks like, which is what we have on the right side. But the first sentence is how will you get your container? And so like, I guess maybe at this point, I hadn't thought about like how I might recommend we address that, but it's almost like a separate row, right? So like residents will need to get containers that are compatible with the curbside form of pickup from the... hauler. And then on the rear yard side, you know, the expectation is that it would be like it is today where you get your own container as you

wish. The way this has kind of evolved here is the first line of the table for both of these or more or less a summary of what that service is. What does that service look like? What does it entail? And then when you move down below that, then it starts to turn into kind of pros and cons or decision-making items. On the

left side, we're talking about how you get your container and how your container is picked up. On the right side, we're only talking about how your container is pick up. So my point is just to specify for people how they get their containers in a rear yard pickup service environment.

I thought of that too. And I added one word, which would be existing trash and recycling containers remain, blah, blah, blah. Because they don't have to do anything different with their containers. They just use the ones they've got. I noticed that sort of incongruency too.

Yeah.

And I think on the other side, purchase or lease all trash. I mean, I had thought of that all part or you could say purchase release new. Because they are going to have to switch out everything. And they may be

new or they may be reused. We don't know. I mean, curbside pickup in the old days was like with your own trash can. So theoretically, they could go back to a manual type of service where it's curbside, but it's with my own trash can. We don't think they're going to do that. So I'm OK saying what we are pretty confident is going to happen. But like...

It would be all.

Yeah.

OK, very good.

But... I guess, is there, why wouldn't we separate? So again, we're talking about how you get your container and we're talking about the service is experienced like on trash day. And I don't know why we wouldn't just create a separate row to separate those ideas.

Put it below and then talk about containers on rear yard, which is. Like

existing containers could continue to be used and as needed new containers can be purchased by homeowners. Like that's how you get your rear yard stuff. Right?

Yeah. Sorry, go ahead. So go ahead. It has something.

I was just going to say that I think we should not assume that we're going to have to all buy new containers. We don't really know that. They may have a way of, if they use those big clamps and pick it up, they may be able to use different kinds. I would just say standardized, all trash containers would need to be standardized and may require purchases of new whatever or something like that.

Well, there are so many factors that go into it. I mean, for instance, at my house, we have a big Republic recycling thing as it is. Yeah, I do already too. So I might not have to buy a

new one. They wouldn't need a new

one, but it is provided by the waste collection company. If that's the case and we still end up with Republic, you would need a new trash container, but not a new recycling container. But it's still provided by the waste collections.

You were making an assumption that they're going to charge everybody for new ones when they may be using one. That's

all to be determined,

right?

It's just too hard. We don't know what would happen

there.

I mean, we can take that. out and just reword it where the containers will have to be compatible with the equipment of the trucks. And then we can add on the other side that you could use any container.

Yes, and then they will have to be which may require additional cost or something.

Did

you have something to say there?

Well, I was just going to say that top box is kind of big, so you could separate it into two boxes. So curbside trash pickup, the first, whether you talk about the containers first, but it seems like the containers should come second. So on rear yard trash pickup, the sentence would be, this is the service currently provided to city residents. On the left side, it would say on trash collection days, residents roll the containers to the curb and return them to an area out of view, blah, blah, blah. And then the second box or whatever would be about containers. So that way people are clear, because I know that maybe it's obvious, but still being clear to people that rear yard trash is what we have right now. So I think just being clear about that at the outset might be the way to break up the two ideas here.

Great. Yeah, that's a good idea. So you're talking about actually on the rear yard side, taking the second sentence and making it the first sentence. Yes. Even just to be, and then explain it, describe it.

You also mentioned doing the parallel that this is a service currently provided residents continue to replace as necessary because you're addressing. Correct. So we'll break

out the container thing and we'll drop it down. We'll put a new box here and then we'll talk about containers on both sides. So the top will talk about the service itself. The second box, we'll talk about the containers and then we'll get into cost environmental impact. And then these other two items down below.

So, and what about the special arrangements?

That was a comment that came from Alderman Gary Feder. He was just worried about residents that may get this, that are thinking I can't for whatever reason, get my container to the curb.

That was a comment that came from Alderman Fader. He was just worried about residents that may get this, that are thinking I can't for whatever reason, get my container to the curb.

you put that in a separate box so would you just leave it with the with that

what's that david and i'm not like

i

well and i saw that but i i mean i'm and i'm not trying to discount like but are we and again i don't want to get into the weeds but if we're saying that i mean is this anybody over 60 do that i mean and i don't need to be but can you describe what we think that Are we talking about people that are disabled? You know, that's why I just want then everybody to say, oh, well, we're going to do curbside. But I am doing I mean, I don't know. That's why maybe maybe that's a little too much information at this point until we're clear on what's going to be available.

Or do you know, like, is there a standard way that people handle that? OK, so we don't know what. So if anything, it would be special arrangements could be

made. I mean, it could be made. And that's something that if it comes back and the decisions made to go to curbside, we're still going to have to talk through details of the scope. And that's one of the things we'll have to talk about is what is the threshold for those special arrangements? Because there is going to be some kind of cost that will be negotiated through that.

Right. But

we don't know what that looks like. Are there

other cities where... Like if you have a disability, for example, of some sort that makes this challenging for your household, like you have a different service. Is that what happens? I mean, do you have examples of that? Yes.

It's in the creep core contract specifically whenever they switched. So how do they, what is the threshold for getting special treatment?

You know,

typically they would, I mean, it would be similar to getting a handicap sticker from the DMV or the state. So they would submit that or proof of that to the trash hauler. And then do

they get charged or is it they get, they just get, do they essentially get rear yard service then?

that is my if i'm remembering correctly yes they get the rear yard service and there's no

additional charge to them because if you set it up in a way where special arrangements are made for like half of your population then that's going to influence that of course that cost because yeah

yeah okay thank you i just didn't know what that really we keep saying that but i don't know what it means well

so i just want to kind of belabor it do you have something else you want to say we lean forward and so i always watch for these cues from you you want to say So I was talking to someone yesterday who is probably 70, not ancient or anything, not really disabled, but they've had two hip replacements. And they said to me, I was talking about this and they said to me you know what, I do not want to will my trash to the curb, especially on an icy day or winter day or whatever. I don't want to be doing that. I don't wanna take the risk. I'm not sure they could get the handicap tag. I mean, I'm just not sure. Do they cut their grass? No, they don't cut their grass. And do they weed their yard? They hire people to do it. So you're gonna hire someone to come and will your trash out? I mean, maybe. Or

you find a neighbor to do it. I mean, people, if you have problems, you like figure it out, right?

I'm just kind of, I'm not really... suggesting any change to this i'm just kind of illuminating the different varieties of you know that's sort of the different tiers of this kind of accessibility problem um that might occur so i don't know i think it's

age plus years of residency

oh my

gosh

okay let's

go

back

to the mission

statement

making it good and it leaves the flexibility for us to negotiate yeah

and if we end up with curbside then we'll we'll have a whole nother discussion on that scope and what those.

And I just want to clarify really quick, sorry. I looked it up on the Creve Coeur website. It's actually, so they require that residents provide a doctor's note confirming that the condition and forward it to Republic Services annually. And then they confirm that there's no one else in the household that is capable of bringing trash to the curb.

Okay. And on the rear yard, just making it parallel, provision of the trash cans. It could just say trash recycling containers provided by residents. It may not have been. Then you'd have to go to purchase and replace as new or

something else. Yeah, we'll try to incorporate that when we

break out that line. Okay, anything else on the top two boxes here? All right, the next box is just the simple cost factor. So again, the biggest struggle we have is not being able to put a range in here of costs. And so how do you word it? To talk about the fact that rear yard is going to be more expensive than curbside. And so we just kept it incredibly general with less expensive than rear yard pickup, more expensive than curdside pickup. And then we get into the two biggest reasons why, which is increased fuel and labor usage.

Do we want to add, I would think insurance too if the guy's going backyard and doing that, but I don't know. But with a less expensive than rear yard pickup, because the question is going to be, everyone asks how much more? Do we want to put until time of bidding? We don't know. Something that's, any kind of?

We have it a couple places in here. We could try to emphasize it.

Okay,

all

right. I just didn't know the bullet point we wanted to say until time of bidding.

Up here above, we could always underline that. So it kind of stands out so people understand that we don't know the costs and this is why. I think that'd be important.

I think you said it and I'll say it in my letter. And when

people ask us, we'll tell

them. Right. That's right. It takes

like seven times. That's the rule of marketing.

Any other comments on that? Making the distinction that way? The next is less ongoing environmental impact. There are over 2,300 single family units, an average of an additional 58 seconds per unit. And then over here, change to curbside collection will result in disposal of of some current single-family trash recycling containers and landfills.

I'll let it go, but I think that's kind of silly. I mean, the landfill issue because... Isn't that an

environmental issue? It is an environmental

issue. They're very different environmental issues. And I have done research and found out that the idling as trucks improve, it's much less of an issue than it used to be. So that's a good thing. But I don't know. You all can leave it there.

And I don't know... We

had a very different environmental question there, but

I have asked, but I'm not sure we found out whether. So there's two types of trucks, diesel and whatever those other ones are called. CNG. CNG. And apparently the CNG is a 40% reduction in emissions. And I don't know whether 58 seconds is representing diesel or CNG.

Well, the 58 seconds is there regardless.

It's regardless. So

you're still going to take 58 seconds longer. Oh, that's right. How much are they putting out? There's less. Okay, gotcha.

That's right. You told me that before. Sorry.

A little information done with recent research is that the diesel is much cleaner in the last few years as well.

Okay, cool. But the thing I was going to suggest in the interest of brevity is to just say, Just next, there are over 2,300 single family units in Clayton. I mean, it's just, everybody knows there's a lot of single family houses. On

gravity, you'd take 58 times 2,300, just put the amount.

You could, but I think just the 58 seconds, it's almost a whole minute is pretty powerful. Well, I think

people, I think giving people a small piece of it, like to your point, like it's more impactful to say, It is estimated that rear yard pickup creates additional idle time of 2,000 hours a year, whatever the, I forget what the number is. So whatever it is. If you want it to be short but have all of the information, that would

be. Yeah, I forgot what that number is, but we can hear it. I mean, we

have, well, it's

1,300 times

58.

2,300 minutes. Times 60

times 60.

Times everything. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 2,300 minutes divided

by 60.

Yeah. I know you have, yeah.

That's a Christmas way to do it. Times 58 divided by 60. Well, that's seconds. So it's really 2,300

minutes. You're

estimating at 58 seconds. I just call it a minute. Yeah. So it's 2,300 minutes a week times 52 weeks or no. Yeah. Okay.

Two minutes because we have two pickups. Let them do the math. Yeah. Right.

Do we want, yeah. I mean, how do I only said

that in order to just make it, I

mean, do we want it like this or do we want,

I support changing it to, it is estimated that rear yard pickup in Clayton increases

truck idling time by a total

of whatever. That would

be the more impactful way.

Shorter and more

impactful. 58 seconds. So switch.

Total increased. Oh. Okay. At like 1900 hours. or. We've got it somewhere so pretty big number. Okay,

and then down below we have these two other items which is curbside containers will create visual visual and physical clutter on collection days that's really getting at the aesthetic issue of the containers at the curb and that's something we certainly heard anecdotally. And then the last item on there is parked vehicles, leaf piles, and snow at the curb will present challenges for curbside collection, which is also the case.

Any questions or comments on those two items there? Well, you know, I have just

something to think about. I guess on the last one, there's two angles on this. One is that there'll be challenges for the curbside truck, but the other challenge is that when we need to do snow removal or leaf collection, that's a challenge for our public work staff if we're doing, I don't know which is more important, or does this say it all?

It shouldn't impact our staff because the container would still need to be on the driveway outside of the right-of-way. So our snow and leaf collection, it doesn't impact us. What impacts the collection department The hauler is the leaves on the curb, parked cars that are on the curb, and then snow piles that are up against the curb. Okay,

I see.

It's whether or not their truck can get to the container.

Just because you just said

anything about this. There's not any... Is there any chance that we would be... asked or need like change parking restrictions to be able to facilitate pickup in either state? I think not. I don't think that's something

we would want to entertain.

Yeah. Or it says I would prefer, again,

talking to children, do you want to say that the city contract force of people once again are reminded it's a citywide choice? being an important theory, I think we say it enough.

I think we say enough. But one thing I was thinking is do we need to tell them how to make their choice? I mean, is like circle your choice? Or how do they

so on the way it will actually be formatted they told us today wouldn't be a B, it would be one or two and on the written survey that you would get you would fill in a bubble just like.

yeah yeah it would just be. Okay

it's just this or that and then, when you do the online version, there would be a little circle and you would click one or two.

I still think. Susan's comment, do we want to add anything after prefer? Not a big deal. I guess to the point of being.

To finish that thought, you could say, I would prefer the city negotiate for A or B, something like that.

yeah and it's an it is an opportunity to point out that it's like citywide that you're not making you don't you won't you won't residents will not be able to make an individual choice we are gathering resident input in order for the board to make a citywide decision

okay

Any other questions or comments on the curbside versus rear yard section of the survey? Okay,

if not, the second part of this, the last section, should yard waste and compost collection be included as a part of the regular monthly rate, or should it be optional with an additional charge? So we've clarified that language a little bit, trying to clarify that it I think we called it opt-in before, but now we used optional with an additional charge. And then below it says a monthly rate for optional services would be determined through that competitive bidding process. And then down below simply, I would prefer standard yard waste and compost collection included in the monthly charge or optional yard waste and compost selection for an additional charge.

You may want to make the, I would prefer parallel

with the one about it. Right. Oh yeah. Any questions or comments on that section? The public

has no issue, or anybody, whoever our trash hauler would be. It's no problem for them to just individually bill optional services.

No, it's fairly common to have the optional yard waste.

And that won't make it more expensive overall?

Shouldn't,

no, because those individuals will be paying for

it. The only thing I'm wondering, I think you've said before that not all waste haulers do compost. Is that correct? That's correct. So there is a chance that the people that respond will only do yard waste and not compost. Is that possible?

I think we would package the two together.

We would

specify that. Correct. Let's go. That's the board's preference. I would like not to see that

service level go down.

But I would envision us packaging those two.

That would eliminate some haulers that can't do it.

Potentially.

What would you say?

Potentially, unless we want to add compost. I just

want to make sure we didn't need to clarify that that was our position that we were. I

mean, we could add compost as an alternate to that bid package to say yard waste and then additional charge for composting. And then if they don't provide it, then they would leave that particular bid alternate blank and we can take that into consideration.

I'm guessing there's a lot of people who don't even know that you can throw compost in at this point, and so they're thinking of those as two separate deals.

Oh, I see what you're saying is that the question could be confusing because people don't realize that they have compost collection as part of their yard waste today. so um i don't know i yeah i agree that i agree that many people do not realize they can that compost can be put in with yard waste so i don't know what

not big no big deal

i would hope we leave it in also education people say oh

they still might not realize they can do it now so i mean you could say should yard waste and compost collection as it is today as part of blah, blah, blah. They'd be sharp enough. I mean, they'd be paying enough attention to the details here to pick up on that or not.

I mean, this is really written looking forward to that next scope should we include these two things or not.

Yeah, I think that's fine. Any other questions or comments on anything in here? General? statements, concerns, anything we need to take into consideration. We've made it clear enough that this is informative and we'll make our own decision.

Counting of hands, right? Let's see the numbers. I think we have.

That's

correct.

And in the cover letter, because there's always a cover letter on the top, I mean, it's really clear in there that this is just used to help the city determine. But it's not... And that's why we're using the words prefer rather than vote, that sort of thing.

Can you go back up to just before the chart? The

part that says the choice?

Yeah, the part that says choice because I think it's a good thing to just make sure we think next decision to be made relates to the scope.

Maybe we'll use the data to determine the next scope. It does sound like we're just going to count hands, but I don't know how else you would say it. I don't think enough. If we changed it to consider. Yeah. Anything else on this?

David, you said that these were going out really just to single or is it a single family or more than

that? Yes. So again, as far as the process is concerned, what will happen is a letter will go out to all residences. So single family, two family, multifamily, everyone's going to get a letter from the mayor. that's going to explain really a lot of the information that's at the top here. This decision has been made, this is why the decision will be made, this is what the decision does for us. At the bottom of that letter, it will have a statement in there that a written or a mailed survey will come to a random sample of single family and two family residences to help determine the next waste collection contract. We will also mention in that letter that the city will have an online poll essentially to determine those preferences as well. So if you don't get the survey, you can still go online to, we're gonna use Balancing Act, that platform we have and submit your opinion on it. So in the end, what we're going to have are two surveys. The first is going to be this random sample that has statistically valid results that will be the mailed survey. And then we'll also have the balancing act survey. And there's really no way to lock that down so that it's just single and two family residents. We could have multifamily, we could have commercial building owners who knows, or we could have people that don't live in Clayton you know, go on there and start clicking on stuff. So, um, but that's, that's the approach. Does that help answer the question?

Well, yeah. And the reason I was asking is because you have some reference in this thing too, like condos or other, uh, buildings. So,

right. And, and we did that just because, uh, you know, you could have a situation where somebody in a multifamily building doesn't read the letter that they're in a conversation somewhere with a single family resident that brings up the waste collection thing. And we just want to make sure that everybody understands what's happening with both sides of the service.

Right. So I wonder if it's important still under choices. Can you scroll a little bit? Is it that important that we're talking about maybe eliminating some things so it's a little shorter? Whether or not it matters about bills for multifamily properties will be the responsibility of building owners, homeowner associations or property managers, depending on the ownership structure of the building. Is all that really necessary?

Again, the only reason we have it in there is just so that it's informative. Just in case we have people that miss it, that other people in the city are educated on what is happening. But that's something we can certainly remove. That is a suggestion that came from the consultant.

Oh,

is that

right?

Okay. Raises the question of whether like, okay, so how are bills to single families going to be? So where do we

say that?

We talk about it.

Not say it together.

We say that the rates will be specific.

Right. I mean, I'm fine taking that part out. Again, that was something they had suggested there. And then the choices then would just be really honing in on single family and two family. We do make the multifamily statement above.

If you keep it above, you need it there, I think.

I think it could confuse people. If you

say, oh, I'm talking about writer choices, that first line talks about single and two families. We

don't talk about how it will be bid, but we talk about that it will be part of this competitive bidding process. We don't say how it will be billed, but we say how it will being included in the bids.

I think you need it there because you don't want people coming away thinking, oh, I'm a single family. I'm the only one that's going to have to pay for my trash. Multifamily won't have to.

Where in here are we telling single families

that they have to pay for their trash? We do at the very top.

We have it right here. Residents will be billed directly by the city's chosen waste hauler for waste collection services.

okay that's true for everyone across the board

everyone across the board

okay yeah so in that case oh it

is

redundant and confusing at that plate and in that placement right like i agree with that

that's a good point ira thank

you

um one other thing i was thinking of you know, when people finish the survey, will there be any communication or in the cover letter about when they might hear from us next or when we'll make this decision? Because I think a lot of people are going to be emailing going, okay, but when are you going to do this? When are you going to decide? When are you gonna let me know how it's going to be?

We do have in there in the draft right now, we talk about when it will be that we'll get the data that we'll formulate the scope in early 2023 and then competitively bid. Yeah, but not with a lot of specificity just because I don't know how long the whole scoping discussion is going to take. Once we get the survey, I don't know if it's going to take us two weeks or two months to figure out what's in the next scope. I just

think people will be chomping at the bit so you can know.

We make it clear, I think, that the scope will be determined in early 2022. Okay. All

righty.

To that point, Mayor, I was wondering... if we wanna consider and so the letter, so all residents got a letter a few months ago that kind of like raised the alarm that some changes might be coming and that there would be a lot of like opportunities for discussion and information and all of that. And I, recognizing that we have discussed this many times in public settings that everyone is welcome to come to or watch recorded later, I wonder if we, what we think about either like, what we think like whether it's like a town hall or designating a discussion session or like, what do we want to actually try to provide an opportunity for folks who have questions about this and are confused by what they might get in the mail to actually like come in person or over Zoom to ask questions

and

share feedback. I mean, that was, I think a lesson learned that we had from the vote and granted this isn't a vote is that we needed more or earlier engagement with folks. And I don't know if people will come or not, but I don't know what other folks think about that, if that would be...

On the online option, there's a general comment area, right? It's not just a check, yes, check, no.

We can add a comment section.

All

right.

If you want to call it. So I

thought about that. I thought about that, Susan. And then I thought, Oh, I don't know that we want people colored unquote, like feeling like they're making the equivalent of public comment through like an online survey versus like, what if we just actually give them the opportunity to come and question or comment, which is where,

well, we are going to have to approve the contract in a public meeting. And, um, I mean, depending on which way we decide to do this, it could be more or less controversial. And that would be a good opportunity for people to come and speak their mind and ask us to do one thing or the other. I mean, So that's an opportunity.

Yeah, I wonder if it's like what I'm thinking about is the letter that went out earlier this year provided no actionable way for a person to follow up on what it meant or what was happening next and so maybe what we want to do is Even just like create a landing page or something where we're going to be sharing information about this and like provide the link in a QR code to the link in the letter so like if you want more information about when we'll be discussing these topics, or like whatever to do that I mean I'm quite sure like rich and I have a word coffee scheduled in December. This will obviously be something we will highlight as something that we will discuss and we'll be giving everyone a chance to talk about it. So I just want to make sure that people who do want to do that, that we make it as easy as we can for them to know how to get the information or provide their feedback. So I think definitely like the letter should definitely have a place they can go to get more information, I think.

And that would, I agree with that. Yeah. And that letter could go out electronically as well as in the mail for those people that we have email for. And that way they could just click on it. I think we've got a pretty good smattering of the letter. We've already been talking about it. A lot of people already know. They know this is coming. So we've been talking about it, we talked about it in our budget reviews and all that. We will send out a letter, we will give a link in the letter to kind of an info tab. I think that's a great way to do it with you know, timelines and whatever else and definitions of things. And then they'll get the survey. That'll be informative. They'll be able to go online.

I think we can, I think

we're pretty good. And then there'll be able to come to our meeting where we're making the final decision and weigh in.

We can put a general page on the website that has the information along with that link, drive them there to get the link to go to balancing act to that. That'll

be the bang the table. page that we're creating okay okay cool and I think also

well and I think also and I again this seems probably obvious to all of us but I still have people like email me and say hey Bridget I think you're my older person so you know encouraging people hey if you live in you know whatever ward one please contact your you know Becky and Rich or you know I mean I don't know if there's a way to put that and say you know we encourage do I live in Bridget yeah But I would just say, you know, we encourage you to contact your older people if you want to talk further. You know, again, but I still have people who say, I think that you're my older person. So, which is understandable. I just, you know,

again,

encouraging that communication. That's all.

I don't care what word they

use. Not important to them. All right,

anything else? We've got a lot of good notes here.

You know, so I just want to encourage, and I know pretty much everybody's doing word coffees at this point, I think. You might want to make sure you do one, you know, coinciding with this effort and really put it out there that this is what you're going to talk about at that coffee for sure. That will really help people feel like they've had a chance to learn about it and weigh in.

Okay. Maybe chief, you can cover this at your coffees with

a cup.

Handing

out citations for any garbage cans left on

the. Well, I think you've got yourself. That's everything

we have here. I think so. So we'll make these final changes and then we'll draft that letter next week. And we'll certainly share that with you, Mayor. You'll be the one that signs it ultimately. So we'll put that together again. A lot of it's just going to mirror what we have as background information on here. But as soon as we have that timeline put together with a little more definite dates for when things are going out, I'll communicate that to the board and public as well.

Yes, Cheryl. Yeah. Come back up to the podium so your remarks will be included. We already know your name and everything.

It's

not in the top sentence.

It is. Actually, it's kind of throughout the document. Correct.

But you know, you reminded me of something. Go back to the very top sentence again, please. Actually. Oh, there you go.

There you go. Yep.

And recycle. Oh, that's a good touch. Well, I've always kind of had this issue with waste as a way of describing it. Waste and solid waste, people think about trash. So I wonder if in the very top, we might just want to say trash and waste collection. I mean, a lot of people know that that includes everything, but do we want to just call it trash and recycling? Well,

yeah,

I mean, there's so waste collection is a blanket term. I know there's to trash recycling and yard waste compost. Yeah, it

is. Let me cover. We cover that right here. So when we get out of this section.

All right. Never mind. It's a lot. Yes. I

think it's really helpful that

we put it in the title. Yeah. Yeah. Very good. I are. Well, maybe we should be clear in the letter. That will be included in the letter. We will make that clear. So we're going to try

to use this to determine the scope of services that we'll ultimately bid. If we bid it both ways, likely going to or could very well end up in a situation where you have two haulers that are both low on both sides. And then, you know, do you do a survey at that point? Procedurally, it's just we don't have the time to do it. It's a little bit clunky. Plus, you would have to tell both of them, hey, this is a great rate for rear yard. This is a great rate per curbside. Can you hold that while we go and have more discussions about what we want to do? It's certainly advantageous to determine your scope in advance of bidding.

So I think I understood your question differently, or I'm on a different page than what you said, David. So we're gathering this information to get ideas about resident feedback. regarding the one service that where we see we might have an option. I think many of us on the board have expressed a desire that the RFP gather the pricing for both options, but that we won't re-survey at that point based on the pricing. We will make a decision when we have and we will have the citizen resident data and we will have pricing data and we will then decide. the contract to enter into, but that we would still put out like bid options or alternates in the RFP. Is that not?

That hasn't been determined yet. We've talked about doing alternatives.

It's just kind of beyond an alternate. They're two separate services. You're going to get different respondents potentially for both of those. You may have some that just bid. Well, then that's okay too. We could do two parallel processes if you'd like. I thought

we were going to get all that data.

Those are two separate scopes. I wouldn't bid it. I wouldn't call either one an alternate. That's almost two separate services you

would bid out. Okay. Right. Thanks. Yeah. Thank you, Cheryl. Okay. All right. Anything else for today? All right. Well, thank you all very much.

Everybody have a great week.

Thanks. You too. Thanks. Thank you. Bye, Ira. Bye, Michelle.

Bye, Bridget.

PB, Lupita D Montoya- bye have a

good weekend oh there's. You too. PB, Lupita Д Montoya- Oh no it didn't it didn't end.